swing to straight legs (mount)

[Invisible Duck]

For next years routines my girls will need to be able to go from straddle sit on the beam and swing up with straight legs to pike stand (hands and feet on the beam).

They are having a bit of trouble doing this. They can all swing up to a squat but can't do it with straight legs. I am at a bit of a loss as to how to teach it!
Some of the girls can get to front support but thats as close as we have gotten!

Any ideas on how to teach this??

thanks!

 

[gymdog]

Swing to pike stand? What level? Not gonna lie, I'm not sure I can do that too well.

We do swing to push up position in L3 here and swing to squat in L4. I start with them early on doing straddle support on the mushroom, then seeing who can swing their legs through to stand. The more advanced groups try to stand onto panel mats stacked behind (have to leave some room though so the legs don't hit). Obviously the mount doesn't really come from a true straddle support like that but I like to work that too at the same time.

I wonder if you could set up a drill on something where they could swing to a pushup/hollow landing their feet on top of something higher than their hands (kind of like a cast horizontal position). If they could do that, they'd have a better chance of being able to snap into pike I think. The problem may be they are thinking only about lifting their bottoms up into the pike instead of getting some air by driving the heels as well. Otherwise I'd work a lot of flexibility.

 

[Invisible Duck]

Thanks gymdog!
haha yeah I'm pretty sure I can't do it either! - lol i'm not going to embarass myself by trying to demonstrate thats for sure!

It is for national level 3. the whole mount is jump to clear straddle support on the end of the beam and hold for 3 seconds, then sit and swing to pike. it's pretty difficult for level 3 I would think.

Those are some good ideas of things to work on though, I will try a couple of them tonight.

" I wonder if you could set up a drill on something where they could swing to a pushup/hollow landing their feet on top of something higher than their hands (kind of like a cast horizontal position). If they could do that, they'd have a better chance of being able to snap into pike I think. The problem may be they are thinking only about lifting their bottoms up into the pike instead of getting some air by driving the heels as well. Otherwise I'd work a lot of flexibility"

Do you think this could work on P-bars? get them to swing on the end and land up on to a box or something behind them? I could maybe start with the box out quite a bit so they land in front support and gradually bring it in closer forcing them to pike so they don't hit their feet?

haha this will give me something to think about once my exams are all done!

 

[ryantroop]

..isnt it basically a jump on with straight legs?

Much like the drill for casting to handstands, try putting a bar on the ground. Start prone (like a pushup), dip the hips, and pop to a pike on the bar, then stand up.

Then, take a p-bar block, and jump from the floor to hands and feet in a pike and stand up.

It may take some time, but the feeling will eventually come I think...


The hard part for kids that age is learning to planche enough to swing like that.. but I suppose sooner than later is always good...

I think the other piece will be teaching them how to use their leg swing to reach the position desired... to drill that.. grab the p-bar block and keep it behind the beam with enough room to swing. When they swing back, move the block in some so they end up standing on the block until they can land on the beam. It may take some time to reset and some energy to move repeatedly.. but it's another alteranative..

Hope those help..

Ryan

 

[gymdog]

..isnt it basically a jump on with straight legs?

I think it is like the straddle swing to squat on in our compulsory routines (swing to push up in L3), but to a pike stand. It's harder than the squat on, obviously. I was being a little facetious and can do it okay, but it doesn't look that great because I can't get that tight of a fold immediately (flexibility issue for me, probably had slightly better than average planche strength for a girl). But it looks super when girls can do it pretty tight and with the toes tucked under (as opposed to flat foot which I assume is the case here). Really nice. I don't know a lot who can do it really nicely like that though.

Do you think this could work on P-bars? get them to swing on the end and land up on to a box or something behind them? I could maybe start with the box out quite a bit so they land in front support and gradually bring it in closer forcing them to pike so they don't hit their feet?

Sounds good, would also be a drill that's easier on the wrists I'd think. I also really like the pushup, dip to jump on the bar from ryantroop! Also to expand on that one, working piked squat on maybe from front support (with spot). I bet that stuff would really help teach them to get their shoulders over in a controlled fashion and help with the active flexibility.

They also need a pretty confident first part of the skill, so on the beam I would work a lot of straddle sit, swing to push up position with feet on the BB to start. They should be able to do that. If they can't do it with straight legs and into a dish shape, then I'd work that until they can really can. You could even make them come immediately back to straddle sit and do it a couple times in a row, they might need to build up some strength.

You could also try spotting cross handstand, lower down piked to pike stand for some of the planche/control action with the beam hand placement.

 

[ShootingStaRr]

in nz its in the l3ndp.
i never had to do it but i know that a good one was they start in front support at the end of the low beam and jump in to a pike stand. this helps them to get their hips up.

the whole idea for this mount is getting the hips up really high to pike them into the beam

hope this helps.
and good luck to your girls !!!

 

[Valentin]

Hi

What i recommend, and i don't coach beam so i am not 100% that this will work, but i am pretty sure it will help

First of all check out Carly Patterson's beam routine from 2004 Athens. She does it.
YouTube - Athens 2004 Carly Patterson Balance Beam (in first 10-15sec)

As you can see this skill is exactly like a cast stoop on on bar. Sooooo If i were you i would get kids to go Swing legs hard and land in front support, immediate jump to pike!!!
Emphasise a kick upward not back and strong planche (lean forward).. Pressure down on the beam is critical..tight strong arms key words. Just like a cast.

Once they can do that start spotting them to do the cast action into a pike stand...and have them work on the cast (or swing) to straddle drill --->.. Setup 2 spot blocks on either side of the beam with room for them to swing the legs. have the kids try to cast straddle onto of the spotting blocks ..

Once they can do that... well really they should be doing the stoop by themselves and there is your mount. Its pretty hard mount really, and i haven't seen to many kids in NZ Level 3b compete that..But its totaly do able. just requires an aggresive swing as they lean forward.

Hope that helps

 

[ShootingStaRr]

in nz i also haven't seen many people do it.

most of them do it with bent legs but there are a few of the that have one leg bent and keep one straight. its hard to explain what i mean by the one leg straight thing

 

[kiwiflyer]

I haven't seen many people do it either. I have one girl who can get into a pretty good pike but only one foot ends upon the beam and she readjusts. She just has a really good swing and lifts her hips really well. She's got awesome heel drive on vault as well. I know this probably doesn't help, but teaching them when they're little/younger makes it easy to get them into the position, but they do tend to lack power. Gosh... hope that didn't come out garbled.

On another note... Valentin, when's the next issue of gym press coming out? I've really been enjoying reading it.

 

[ShootingStaRr]

most of the people i have seen do a similar thing to that.

 

[Valentin]

Hi

ShootingStar i understand what you mean. I think i have seen 1-2 girls in the wellington region do them to 2 feet, most who try usually just end up doing what you said the 1 foot on 1 foot off.

kiwiflyer i am glad you have enjoyed TheGymPress. I don't think i will be able to get any new issue out this year, as i am trying as hard as i can to re-format, and just revise some of the old articles to put on the new website. It takes forever that. I hope next year thought to be able to continue buisness as usual haha. I will also add heaps of other stuff that will be of use to coaches.

Sad thing will be that articles will no longer be free, but rather will cost like $2-5 USD (depending on size, content, etc..). that money will predominantly go to the author of the article (75% for the author, and 15% for TheGymPress, to cover fees). All and all i hope to make The Gym Press next year way way way way more beneficial to coaches. stay tuned.

Laura let us know how you get on.

 

[Invisible Duck]

thanks everyone for the ideas!

This week I had them try it on the end of the p-bars and swing up onto a box and gradually moved it a little closer. Most of them could do this (we still haven't gotten to a tight pike but we're getting there ) on the beam a few can get to front support - valentin thats a good idea to get them to jump to pike immediately - and one girl can swing up with straight legs but can't quite get her feet on - she get her ankles to the beam and just squeezes on tight so she is stuck there! lol it looks pretty funny!

the girls have done 3C this year but I am thinking of having them do 3B next year rather than level 4 simply because they are quite young and small and I don't think they will be ready for level 4. A couple of them competed the 3B beam routine this year but swung up with bent legs and then straightened them, but if they are competing in 3B then I really want them to be able to do it properly!

We shall persevere though and as you mentioned Valentin I think we need to work on planche strength and pushing with their arms as well as using their legs and the straddle idea is good too! lots of ideas to play around with!

thanks everyone