Behavioral Issues in the Gym

[Mag_7_Fan96]

I'm not a parent or anything but I am studying to work with children and I have ADD so here's my opinion. First of all make sure that she knows the rules and expectations. Focus on rewarding her good behaviour, don't focus on punishing her misbehaviour. If she follows the instructions, note it and make sure that her coaches praise her for it. If she waits her turns, praise it again. Anything that is good behaviour make sure that she is praised and if she behaves (let's say 75% of the time) she EARNS her next lesson. Make sure that she understands this. After her lesson tell her what you didn't like about her behaviour but also tell her the good points and praise her for them. Then tell her if she earned her next lesson or not. If she doesn't behave she does not get the next lesson. It's better to reinforce positive behaviour than it is to punish negative behaviour. It usually gets better, quicker and more permanent results.

I would also add that maybe there could be certain rules that, if broken, automatically means she doesn't get her next lesson. By this I mean behaviour that is dangerous to her or others.

 

[ThreeGirlsForMe]

It is so funny that you ask. I was sobbing on the phone to my SIL and she suggested that I contact the school counselor for a referral to just this thing. I'll admit to not knowing a lot about the symptoms in smaller kids. I teach high school so I see it at that age range. I am going taking the day off tomorrow to go to school in the morning when I drop Bella off and talk to the counselor about this possibility.

Awe, your pain is so easy to hear and I can so totally relate. I was going to also suggest an ADD/ADHD work up. My daughter has ADD-primary inattentive and she is a TOTALLY different kid on the meds. She didn't run around as much as it sounds your DD does (since she does not have the "H") but she couldn't pay attention or remember a correction to save her life. The first day she was on the meds, I saw my perpetually sloppy daughter who just did the skills to get back to the side line and talk transform into a child that suddenly CARED to it right because she could suddenly FOCUS on what she needed to do. I sat and watched her and cried the whole time. Suddenly, the girl that I knew was in there was right in front of me. The gym is SOOO stimulating - music playing, people on floor, vault, bars, beam all simultaneously that for a kid with these challenges, it is almost impossible to focus and work.

((HUGS))

 

[10.0]

I agree with setting the rules and pulling her out if she does not follow, I am sure the coach will be on board.

I can tell you from a coaching angle A LOT of kids are like this, I feel like I am a baby sitter or police officer more than a gymnastics coach.

But in the end what made me hate coaching was children like this with parents unlike you who don't give a rats butt and won't agree to any kind of punishment. I have sent them out before just to have them send right back in. Personally I couldn't deal with it as I felt like the kids didn't want to be there and the parents didn't care how their children acted but were angry that "Suzie was not kipping yet." I am glad you see the issue and want to fix it because for every one of you there are 1,000 parents who don't care.

 

[emandelsmom]

I had typed out a whole thing and lost it. UGH. Anyway, I am a teacher, mom of a child with ADD etc.
The general idea was use a behavior contract. Rules, consequences and rewards. I have a daughter with ADD and this helps with her. I gave a copy to her coaches. They support it. We signed it, she signed it. We read it everytime before we left for gym. It helps to show her boundaries.
Referral for ADD/ADHD is generally given by the pediatrician here. Teachers are not allowed to say a child has this. If they do, then the school district has to pay for the testing. Teachers drop hints: very active child, very bright, loves attention, dreamy child, lacks focus, lacks attention to detail, etc. Call the dr. Tell the nurse or whomever your concerns and what the teacher and coaches are saying. We had to show it in three areas: home, school, and gym. Then we got the referral.
Hope this helps. Hang in there. I have been there.

 

[emandelsmom]

My mom keeps reassuring me that I will be glad she is strong willed when she is an adul, but I'll be honest Bog....right now she is kickin' my butt.

Oh, I have so been there. Where I said, either she gets on ADD/ADHD meds or I get on something. LOL I have been so upset that I shake all over and beg for some peace. But try the behavior contract, and call the pediatrician. Remember if it is ADD, she can't help it. Her brain is literally missing a chemical. This is NOT your fault. You are NOT a bad parent. This is usually genetic. It runs strongly in my hubby's family. Hang in there. There is help.

 

[bluesocks]

My life has changed by reading and learning from Dr. Ross Green. He has a website: Collaborative Problem Solving Approach by Dr. Ross Greene | Lives in the Balance

Anyway, this is how I approach parenting with my very spirited, very strong-willed, very intense daughter. I took the day long seminar online and it has truly changed my outlook.

He approaches the difficulties from the perspective of needing to learn skills. Much like we would provide tutoring for a child behind in reading or math, we need to provide intensive teaching for a child with difficulties in social and behavioral skills. It is hard work and I am not perfect at using this method. But, when I use it, it works.

Just thought I would share. I won't go into more details because there is so much available on the website.

Blue

 

[NGL780309]

I had a situation much like this one with my DD who just turned 6, so same age range. She is perfectly well behaved at gym now, but had huge behavior issues IMHO before. Granted I'm speaking of when she was 4.5 to shortly before her 6th birthday. She wouldn't pay attention and would pretty much goof off most of the time. She'd miss her turn and when she would take a turn she would do things as sloppy as possible. I'd get really frustrated with her because I KNOW she knows how to behave. She had a different coach from age 4-4.5 and she behaved for that coach very well. I tried speaking to the coach because I felt like the coach was just allowing it. That didn't do any good. She'd allow her to act like a fool and not care if she took her turn or tried very hard. One day it took every ounce of restraint not to walk out on the floor and grab her because she was standing in line for vault and was bothering another girl. They were playing, but my DD was hanging on this girl and they were pushing each other and the coach did nothing! I was embarrassed. Even at 4.5 she knew better. She's older now, but that's not why her behavior improved. Her behavior improved when she had a coach that set a clear expectation and consequences. The reason I don't believe it was her maturing is because the behavior changed overnight when we changed gyms. At first I thought she was just on her best behavior because it was a new place, but she's never resorted back to her old ways. The other major difference is that the rotations are well organized. It's not rotate and then wait 15 minutes for the coach to come over there and then send her to do something without any supervision for the rest of the rotation. They don't vault 3 times in a 45 minute rotation and spend the rest of the time waiting in line. They actually work and have things set up for minimal distraction. It's well structured and she needed that. I don't know if your DD's situation is the same. DD is now probably the best behaved kid in her group. Many of them are starting to get to the age where they have attitude and thankfully that was never DD's problem. She just had a hard time standing still and waiting.

 

[Bella's Mom]

I want to thank everyone for all the encouraging words, advice, and resources. I have a lot to think about and some plans to make. But now, I'm beat so I'm going to bed. I have a headache from the crying earlier tonight (see, this is why I never cry) and my eyelids are swollen so it is definitely time for me to hit the hay.

I'm not trying to shut down the thread so if others have more to add, I'll read more tomorrow. And again...thanks so much CB community.

 

[NGL780309]

I replied right after reading your first post, as I often do, without reading anyone else's response. I didn't realize your DD was having behavior issues at school also. I didn't have a problem with that with DD. She was in preschool at the time and never was in trouble or caused problems. She had never had any behavior issues anywhere else either. It was just more that she'd get to gym and be really crazy. She was there to get her energy out and most of practice was spend doing nothing. Some of my frustrations weren't always behavior related, but gymnastics related. She'd play rather than work when she actually had a turn. She'd go to beam and not have a coach watching anything she was doing or really have clear instructions so she'd just do whatever she pleased. The difference now is that everything is structured. They warm-up together, they give clear assignments, the coach actually walks around and monitors what they are doing. So all the problems have been eliminated in DD's case. It doesn't sound like the issue is quite the same, though lack of structure could be contributing to the problems. I just know when we changed gyms I was amazed with how structured the practice was and how much more work the girls did. It was like a completely different world. Then after that first practice the coach apologized that things had been a little unstructured due to it being Halloween. I couldn't wait to see what she considered a structured practice! Again, it doesn't sound like gym is the only area of concern so perhaps this is of now use to you.

 

[Sarah'sMom]

I have an almost 7 year old who has been very much a challenge since she started gymnastics at 3 1/2. At times I have been absolutely mortified. She does not have ADHD, although she is a high energy child.

To make a long, long story short, our turn around in school and in gymnastics was because of very specific rules. Just telling her to be good and pay attention and mind did not suffice. She needed - do not do this, do not do that, etc. I made well over 20 different rules for gymnastics - basically my pet peeves, including very specific rules about how to respect others and be a good team mate - not just the general values. When we first started, I would remind my daughter the rules before every class. And, at some point I switched to my daughter listing as many of the rules as she could remember. After a time we did not have to go through the reminders unless I saw a rule being broken and then there were further reminders. The specificity really helped. I think in the heat of the moment of having fun they do forget if they do not have such a reinforcement of the rules. I have also given her great praise when she has a great class following all the rules. And, I every so often point out how much more she has been able to do and the coaches teach her since she has been behaving.

I have always been supportive about my daughter being sent out of class if she is not mind, particularly if there is a safety issue. But not all coaches do that even when I have said I will back them. I think sometimes a coach is a afraid that a parent will complain if a child is being sent out of class - like I paid for this class and you are wasting my money. Personally I like the coach not letting my child get away with things. The lessons they learn in gymnastics can help so much in life.

 

[GymnastJoy]

Have not been in this situation so no advice to give. But want to commend you for being such a concerned, involved mom. We all see kids behaving as you describe but the difference between them and Bella is a mom taking the initiative to better the situation. I hope that your dd's coach and teacher will be on board for whatever you decide is best. And that you are looking at your child as a whole rather than just as a gymnast is wonderful. Hang in there. Being a parent is really tough sometimes.

 

[Empowered]

I got home late and I don't have much advise to offer that hasn't already been mentioned, but I can offer support as a mom with an ADHD child. Parenting a child with that level of energy and hyperactivity is enough to drive one to drink. I tried to convince myself for years that boys would be boys and he was just an active little guy and would eventually out grow it. Unfortunately if she does indeed have this disorder, all the consequences will have a lesser effect because of how her brain is wired so you have to find out what's going on ASAP.

I read the following line from an ADHD article when I was doing some research on my own son..."If you want to make sense out of inexplicable behaviors by someone with ADHD, just ask yourself: “What behavior makes sense if you only had 4 seconds left to live?" I always go back to this line whenever my son does something boneheaded (it still happens, even with medication) and remind myself to be patient. Talk to her doctor, get a diagnosis one way or another and go from there. I wish you all the best and hope everything is better soon.

 

[Empowered]

I also wanted to add really quickly, kudos to you sincerely for recognizing and wanting to deal with this behavior. It's always easier as a parent to make excuses, but you aren't and I admire you so much for that. It's hard to look at our own little angels who we love so much and realize their not perfect, but noticing that doesn't mean we love them any less... It just means we're doing our job.

 

[momof5]

We also had this issue with my little DD who is 6 and on swim team. For weeks I was sounding like a broken record. I was constently frustrated that she wasn't behaving. Her coach was dealing with it but the coach didn't always see it or had other kids to deal with. I was always telling her the same things but not seeing a change in behaviour. I tried positive reinforcement but it wasn't working so I gave her only 3 rules. Look at the coach when he is speaking, follow directions, and work hard. I told her that I was pulling her out of swim team for the day if those 3 rules weren't followed. That day I pulled her out and she was so embarrased. The whole next week she was so much better at practice. Then she had a day of misbehavior and I pulled her out of class again. She has been so much better. I think its been two months since I did this and we haven't had any more problems. Good luck to you.

 

[sally]

I had this problem with my son. I used a card system that my dd prep teacher used when she first started prep. It works wonders as it calmed my son down. There is a red yellow green cards. green is used for being good and if you get I think it was 10 (Can't really remember the number ) in a row you get a prize from the magic box. You get 2 warnings which is the yellow card and the red card well you can imagine. We never got to the red card but it is time out. It worked great because they wanted to pick a prize out of the magic box, and it was just cheap things in the box. Also the green cards were kept by having a book with stickers to every time he was given a green card he would pick a sticker and put it in his book.

 

[CoachGoofy]

I was wondering on the ADHD thing too. I have a number of ADHD athletes, & the little ones and your Bella sound a lot alike.

As a coach it is very difficult to keep all the parents happy in terms of behavior expectations & consequences--I have met kids who have NEVER been told 'no' in their whole lives, & kids whose parents expect me to shut down any disobedience or disrespect as soon as it starts. It's extremely hard to keep to all of those expectations & be a consistent coach at the same time. I find myself in the awkward position of being the most strict adult in some kids' lives! Or with parents on one hand saying "why are you so tough on them?" and "why can't she do XYZ?" in the same breath. It's not a pleasant place to be.

As a coach, I really appreciate the parents who have a realistic view of their kids' behavior & work with us to find a solution. Then I get to spend more time on the skills and less on the "we don't jump from there to there because it's not safe for anyone here" conversation.

 

[gymster]

Okay! I too feel your pain! Here is the deal! I hate labels and I hate kids on meds! I am not a DR and I can not tell you what to do! However, I can tell you this! You just described My dd at that age! I avoided testing her and meds till she was ten! Socially she is a disaster! She has very few friends and deals with the jealousy monster on a daily basis! Cute is no longer cute! She rocks at gym because she has no fear! She is unable to process consequences! While this makes for a great gym quality it also makes for a Dangerous one! The best explanation I ever got came from our USAG State Chairman. She explained that it would be like you or me sitting in a car listening to our favorite song on the radio. At the same time every exsisting radio station in the world is playing something different at the same volume, and all you need to do is listen to your song. You can imagine you would probably run around crazy too! We can't even begin to imagine the frustration you would feel! So my advice is first have her tested see if this is truly the case. There are more advanced test out there than they had in the past. Testing today actually test brain waves not just a questionare! It is much like an EEG. Then, If the DR. thinks she needs it, Medicate! We tried the MSG thing and all sort of things before we gave in. I hate I waisted so much time, because I feel had we acted sooner, she might have more friends and be able to function better socially. Secondly, If you trust your coaches stay out of the lobby! You may actually be the fuel to her fire! It will be difficult at first but eventually you will be frustrated when you have to go! It will also make the meets that much better, because you will see exstreme progress! Parental lobby absence aids in creating a gymnast biggest fan rather than her closest critic! Besides, most Gym lobbies only foster Drama among the Momma's anyways! Finally, Know you are not alone and take each day as it comes. Some days will be great, and others... well I call those my Charachter building days! A couple of good books are the Strong Willed child by James Dobson and Teaching with Love and Logic! But know that Your child is unique and what works for most may or may not work for yours! My husband and I used to laugh and say I wonder what the Nanny would do if she got a hold of our DD! She would drive her into Looney Farm! Now, you can also probably tell from my rambling that my apple does not fall too far from the tree!! LOL! GOOD Luck! Sending Hugs and Prayers:O)

 

[Tumblequeensmom]

It is so funny that you ask. I was sobbing on the phone to my SIL and she suggested that I contact the school counselor for a referral to just this thing. I'll admit to not knowing a lot about the symptoms in smaller kids. I teach high school so I see it at that age range. I am going taking the day off tomorrow to go to school in the morning when I drop Bella off and talk to the counselor about this possibility.

I LOVE LOVE LOVE Bog's advice!! But I was concerned once you said she has the same behavior issues at school.

I was going to suggest the ADD/ADHD workup as well. I have both personal (my son) and professional experience with this issue, and it is amazing how once the kids are diagnosed and undergo therapy/meds (if necessary) how delightful these kids are! Most important, is that once the disorder is controlled, their academic achievements soar, along w/their social skills. In fact, after struggling academically and personally in the lower elementary grades, my son was diagnosed and treated in 4th grade. He recently graduated from Virginia Tech (Dean's list, I might add).

Sorry to go off tangent here, but it really, truly irritates me to no end to hear parents say "Oh, I would NEVER medicate my child." Would you withhold insulin from a diabetic?? Or my favorite "I don't want my child labelled." O.K.... these kids ARE labelled anyway... by their peers AND teachers! Sorry for my rant!!

 

[Tumblequeensmom]

Gymster, I just went back and read all the posts... my rant was NOT directed towards you at all.... it was just my own personal experience dealing w/friends, other teachers at school and working w/kids.

 

[Aussie_coach]

The sort of behavior you describe is not unusual in a child her age. Every child develops different skills at different times. Kids like your daughter often develop some skills earlier than usual and others later. It seems she is above her years in coordination and intelligence. But self control can be slow to develop, lots of kids at 6 or 7 still have very, very limited amounts of self control. Concepts of fairness and consequences are hard to understand at this age, you are not doing anything wrong as a parent. She is simply not ready to understand all of these concepts.

Kids her age live in the moment, they do what feels right at the time, they aren't yet capable of delayed gratification. They can't think "OK well I'll work hard now, and I'll see the results in a few months", or "I'll behave now, because I will have consequences later".

Her intelligence may also be an issue. many very highly intelligent kids are mistaken as having ADHD, these are the signs of a high intelligent child and you'll find a big crossover between these signs and ADHD symptoms.
1. Very high energy levels
2. Require less sleep than other kids her age
3. An almost adult sense of humour well beyond her years
4. Picks up on concepts very quickly almost like she always knew them
5. language very developed for age
6. Motor milestones ahead of her age
7. Needs constant stimulation to keep her interest, the brain needs more stimulation than the average child.

Highly intelligent kids are very active, especially at her age. They get bored quickly and will be disruptive. Many have never had to try in their life to do anything and pick things up so quickly that they don't really understand what it means to actually try. They will just play up if they have to put any effort in, because they are used to just getting it straight away.

It also seems interesting that your childs coach ignores bad behaviour and hopes it will just go away, but your daughter will keep at it until she can't be ignored. It means your daughter loves attention of course as do many girls her age, but she keeps trying to get it by doing the wrong thing. This often means that it is too difficult to earn attention from doing the right thing. Think about it from her point of view. If a child is well behaved, it might be recognized and it might not, often it is not rewarded until say the end of the week or after a long time of good behavior. While bad behavior can almost guarantee immediate attention, or attention if she pushes it far enough. Does this coach give as much praise and attention for good behavior?

If you are unhappy with gym consequences, give your own. If she misbehaves at gym then its home to bed early with no treats or television, its likely she will test you a bit if you put such consequences in place but stand firm and she will soon get the idea.