WAG Discussion of abuse in USAG - Nassar

[chalkbowl]

I guess what Im looking for is a Child protective service of sports. Does that non profit exist? Is there someone kids could go to outside of the governing organization that would get lawyers involved so fast your head will spin and sue every single person complicit? Because it isnt just Nassar. Coaches all over the nation are violating Safesport conduct every single day of the week and it's enough. We dont let our teachers groom and use predatory behaviors, shaming, hazing, etc at our schools, why in the heck are we paying for it in sports? If the USA Gymnastics association will not protect our children, we must.

I, personally, took the safesport course last night. So there is no reason every single coach in america shouldnt have taken it by now. If they havent even made that happen, it's beyond the time of parental action and involvement.

This exists: http://www.achefoundation.org/
Not sure if they help with the extent you are talking about though.

 

[sce]

I thought I remembered reading an article that USAG was backing out of the purchase of the ranch and looking into building a training center in Colorado Springs like the men. Is this true, or was it just a rumor?

I heard that they backed out of the ranch purchase but had not heard that they settled on an alternative location.

 

[profmom]

It's complicated because the individual episodes of abuse involving direct physical contact are all prohibited under state law and state laws vary wildly in terms of how offenses are identified and charged, and what the statutes of limitations are. The problem of sexual exploitation of minors is far bigger than gymnastics, and between federalism and the traditionally state-oriented nature of private crime and the tendency to view each institution (private schools, religious organizations, individual sports, scouting, etc.) as a separate and isolated entity, it's far too easy for a determined predator to shift venues both physically and institutionally when caught. I don't think the problem can be solved through private litigation, and the current mechanisms have a lot of gaps and loopholes. The redefinition of computer-based child pornography as a federal offense was in part a way of getting around all of these issues, as it crosses institutional barriers and allows for a unified system of reporting and prosecution that applies in the same way across state lines.

If you want my $.02, I'd like to see new legislation drafted on the federal level that defines child sexual exploitation as a federal criminal offense that can be investigated and prosecuted by the FBI. (I acknowledge that there are constitutional issues with this proposal, but let's just assume for a moment that one could figure out some way of getting around the relevant case law -- I do have an idea here.) We could then have a true national sex offender registry that does not depend upon an uneven and inconsistent reporting system initiated at the state level, and we could talk about the problem itself rather than the issue in the Catholic Church, the scandal in gymnastics, the problem in scouting, the concerns about private school teachers, etc.

This solution would, of course, require Congress to act, so I am not holding my breath.

 

[CAKE]

This exists: http://www.achefoundation.org/
Not sure if they help with the extent you are talking about though.

Thank you!! Courtney Kiehl is in my state so that looks like a great place to start.. Id like to see something much bigger. Like I said, a Children in Sports Protective Service. Children can get online and make anonymous tips. Sure, you might deal with some vendetta reports.. but Id rather give kids an outlet beyond their parents who have invested so much time and money in the kids sport that sometimes they have no idea of what to do, how many waves to make. I truly respect the time and effort the Raisman's have put in... they have been invested and it still happened because of the culture we must submit to to participate at elite levels in this sport. There needs to be an independent 3rd party that keeps coaches in check if the USA Gymnastics association will not do it. Instead the association has enabled a culture of fear and often child abuse. It has created a whole culture of grooming behaviors allowing younger and younger children to get sacrificed on the pyre of winning every year. There is dysfunction in every sport it seems but gymnastics is one of the worst for the self esteem of young women and that needs to change. What other sport encourages children to basically drop out of highschool and spend 30+ hours in a gym from agest as young at 9-10???????? Let's make this healthier for everyone. As someone new the sport it is disappointing to find it in such disarray.

The CEO made 585,000 in 2015, there isnt a lack of money to address the problem.

 

[GymFan96]

If parents wont even band together and stop sending their kids to that ranch where they dont even allow parents to stay with their own children, then I guess Im just speaking in the wind, but yuck yuck yuck to paying money to people to abuse your children and if we dont learn anything from this and help the culture, it is an absolute tragedy. If we just sit by and watch these young women who are brave enough to finally speak out and do it on our their own, SHAME ON US.

I don't think the issue is parents not staying at the ranch. There are many overnight camps where kids stay without parents, and no one gets abused because they have proper supervision and protocols. If parents were required to accompany their kids to every camp and competition, the US would barely have any Olympians because almost all parents have jobs or other kids to care for and don't have the time or money to follow their elite gymnast all over the world.

Where USAG went wrong was failing to have proper supervision and letting a male doctor be alone with minors.

 

[bogwoppit]

I don't think the issue is parents not staying at the ranch. There are many overnight camps where kids stay without parents, and no one gets abused because they have proper supervision and protocols. If parents were required to accompany their kids to every camp and competition, the US would barely have any Olympians because almost all parents have jobs or other kids to care for and don't have the time or money to follow their elite gymnast all over the world.

Where USAG went wrong was failing to have proper supervision and letting a male doctor be alone with minors.

But coaches should not be alone with gymnasts either. That is basic and other countries do find ways to manage that with elites. I also do not think parents need to be staying at the camps, but gymnasts should never be alone with an unrelated adult there, not matter who they are. Plus when travelling to meets. If the camp was in a more central place it would be easier.

But I have seen that USAG is making travel to the camps better, with gymnasts being greeted at the airport and camp transport. No more driving with the coaches. Though there will be parents that this will be a nightmare for, plus $$$.

 

[GymFan96]

But coaches should not be alone with gymnasts either. That is basic and other countries do find ways to manage that with elites. I also do not think parents need to be staying at the camps, but gymnasts should never be alone with an unrelated adult there, not matter who they are. Plus when travelling to meets. If the camp was in a more central place it would be easier.

But I have seen that USAG is making travel to the camps better, with gymnasts being greeted at the airport and camp transport. No more driving with the coaches. Though there will be parents that this will be a nightmare for, plus $$$.

I have to say I don't really understand this idea. Greeted at the airport and transported by whom? How is them riding with other random strangers better than riding with their own coaches they know and trust? And why will it cost the parents extra money, they're required to fly in with their kid?

 

[bogwoppit]

I have to say I don't really understand this idea. Greeted at the airport and transported by whom? How is them riding with other random strangers better than riding with their own coaches they know and trust? And why will it cost the parents extra money, they're required to fly in with their kid?

Transported in groups. I do this stuff for work sometimes. We meet their flights, keep them together until the bus arrives. Load them and chaperone them to the destination. Very safe. No adults alone with them. In he same way a child would fly as an unaccompanied minor on their flight. It happens a lot for summer camps.

Parents are not required to fly in with their kids. But the transport will obviously not be free, but coaches can still fly with the gymnast, just not be alone with them in a rental car.

 

[MeetDirector]

Nassar to Change his Plea ...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...ics-doctor-nassar-weighs-plea-deal/107709034/

 

[sce]

Nassar to Change his Plea ...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...ics-doctor-nassar-weighs-plea-deal/107709034/

Sounds like he's looking to avoid a trial.

 

[LindyHopper]

Sounds like he's looking to avoid a trial.

Or, with Aly's revelations on TV and in her book, finally realized that denying that it had happened, and that his behavior was beyond disgusting was futile.

 

[ladybird]

Or, with Aly's revelations on TV and in her book, finally realized that denying that it had happened, and that his behavior was beyond disgusting was futile.

Yes, this!

And I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s going to find his way out of this like Marvin Sharp did.

 

[BachFlyer]

Or, with Aly's revelations on TV and in her book, finally realized that denying that it had happened, and that his behavior was beyond disgusting was futile.

I doubt he wanted to avoid the trial, or that he's coming to any real honest look at himself, but I do think that the timing of Aly and Mckayla coming forward may have helped convince his legal team that they had no chance in hell of winning, and his only shot at something less than Life would be a guilty plea. He may be taking the advice of his team, but I don't think he really thinks he's guilty.

 

[BachFlyer]

Yes, this!
And I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s going to find his way out of this like Marvin Sharp did.

I really hope not. His victims and their families deserve to see him serve time, in my opinion.

 

[LindyHopper]

but I don't think he really thinks he's guilty

Oh, I don't think he does either. Just that he and his team realize it's futile to deny it. I still thinks he believes he wasn't doing anything inappropriate.

 

[ladybird]

I really hope not. His victims and their families deserve to see him serve time, in my opinion.

Agreed.

 

[Sasha]

I still thinks he believes he wasn't doing anything inappropriate.

Interesting. Do others also feel he truly thinks he was perfectly above board to be performing his ungloved 'techniques' on scores of pre-teen and teen girls? I'm not belittling you or your comment, just surprised and curious about your perception since mine is so different...

Personally, I think he knew exactly what he was doing, knew full well that it would not be "acceptable practice" in the eyes of others if they knew what he was doing, which is why he worked so hard not to get caught - with all the grooming behaviors, making sure to be alone with the gymnasts, or positioning himself to block the view of what he was doing from others, when performing his 'techniques'...

If he really thought the techniques in question were legitimately above-board, helpful, necessary, and valuable to so many young gymnasts with a wide range of physical therapeutic needs (back, hip, etc), he would have been collaborating, publicizing and sharing in the professional medical and athletic communities - discussing, teaching others, etc, all openly, just as he was known for in his more innocuous techniques, and generally as renowned medical professionals do to both further their fields and their own careers.

 

[coachmolly]

This might be better suited for a new thread, but how are your gyms addressing the safe sport rules? Are they addressing them at all? Have any changes been made? Have they even been mentioned?
I appreciate the effort, but the rules aren't going to do any good unless clubs are actually implementing them and I know the club where I work is not. They haven't been mentioned at all, not sure if the owner even knows they exist. She just tells us "Never be alone with a student." I've seen posts from others on here who have indicated their clubs have really gone ahead full force with enforcing the policies which is great, I'm just skeptical about how many gyms are doing anything with them.

 

[suds]

I think he knew exactly what he was doing, knew full well that it would not be "acceptable practice" in the eyes of others if they knew what he was doing.

Yes.
Given the plethora of facts that have come to light, originating from many different sources, over a long range of time, he knew exactly what he was doing.

 

[LindyHopper]

I'm not belittling you or your comment, just surprised and curious about your perception since mine is so different...

To clarify, I think that he felt he was entitled (maybe due to status) to do what he did. Because he was "entitled", he didn't feel it was wrong.

Truly, I don't really know. All I know is that I don't feel like I have seen any remorse.