Need to repeat Level 5?

[lettrich]

I have been "lurking" for a while but 1st time posting. My daughter is 8. She competed level 5 last year - went to states & scored a 34.7. She is now working on level 6 skills for the last month or so & is having trouble with bars & floor. She is scared to do flyaways, is weak on bars & is scared to do back tucks. Her gym does not start to compete until Nov or so. Today her coach said she should compete level 5 again next year while training with the 6's. I kind of feel that they are not giving her enough of a chance to learn the new skills. She is in the gym for 20 hours a week during the summer & they go down to 16 hours during the school year. I am disappointed that her coach wants her to repeat a level. My daughter likes her coach but whenever she does anything wrong the coach yells at her. I am wondering if this is why she is afraid to try new skills - for fear of being yelled at. My daughter is ok with doing level 5 meets but I think its just because she is scared to do the new skills. My husband & I are frustrated with the amount of time - all the driving around,etc (and money) we put into this sport & feel she should progress & not remain stagnant for a year. We are thinking of letting her compete 2 level 5 meets & then make her wait to compete 6 when she has all the necessary skills. Does this sound reasonable? Has anyone else had these issues? Thanks!

 

[Deleted member D3987]

trust the yelling coach.

 

[Empowered]

As a mom to a new L6 who is about to start competing let me just tell you this level is freaking HARD! At our gym, to compete a fall season you had to have all the L6 skills by April. To consider competing the level in November, your daughter really should have mastered all of the skills already.

You have to remember that when it comes to competition it's not just the individual skill, it must be connected and connecting the level 6 skills is tough. She won't just have to throw the flyaway, she has to throw it at the end of what is a very technically difficult bar routine. And she isn't just doing a back tuck, she has to throw that pass as the last skill in an physically demanding floor exercise.

I know repeating might seem demoralizing, but repeating doesn't mean she isn't progressing. I have seen many a second year 5 have a huge year and then come out and rock 6 when they are really ready. Trust her coach, and let her repeat 5 while training 6. Don't punish her by taking away even part of the season just because she didn't hit L6.

 

[CoachTodd]

On these types of posts, I always ask, "does she need to compete while she's working the new skills?" There is nothing wrong with not going to meets until you are comfortable doing the skills you wish to compete. The next question that comes to mind would be "will she actually be working the level 6 routines while competing the level 5 meets or spending time trying to get a perfect level 5?"
Unfortunately I've worked with coaches that only see scores and money from private lessons so I may be a little tainted on how I look at the "lets do this level for another season" issue. She's 8 years old so she has plenty of time to progress.

 

[lettrich]

I have no problem with her not competing level 6 until she has the necessary skills. I have also told her that she can do 2 level 5 meets that are local until then. The coach said she will be learning the level 6 skills she is comfortable with & will also learn the routines. She can already do level 6 beam. I am just afraid if we let her do another whole year of 5 she will become complacent & not push herself to learn new skills. I am also fearful the coach will "give up on her" and not focus on her learning new skills.

 

[vagymmomma]

Everyone can tell you anecdotal stories, but my experience is that way more people regret moving early than repeating. The key is to push for the uptraining. We have a level 5 in a similar situation (same age) who is repeating (she scored a 35.2 at state and already has her flyaway). She uptrains one day a week with the Level 6 team and is going to knock the socks off of level 5 this year. She was very demoralized at the end of level 5 because she didn't do as well as she expected (it was all about the bar connections -- and level 6 is even tougher). Good luck -- you need to trust the coaches or think about going somewhere else where you do.

 

[gymmomof1]

As a mom to a new L6 who is about to start competing let me just tell you this level is freaking HARD! At our gym, to compete a fall season you had to have all the L6 skills by April. To consider competing the level in November, your daughter really should have mastered all of the skills already.You have to remember that when it comes to competition it's not just the individual skill, it must be connected and connecting the level 6 skills is tough. She won't just have to throw the flyaway, she has to throw it at the end of what is a very technically difficult bar routine. And she isn't just doing a back tuck, she has to throw that pass as the last skill in an physically demanding floor exercise.I know repeating might seem demoralizing, but repeating doesn't mean she isn't progressing. I have seen many a second year 5 have a huge year and then come out and rock 6 when they are really ready. Trust her coach, and let her repeat 5 while training 6. Don't punish her by taking away even part of the season just because she didn't hit L6.

Totally agree. Dd did L6 and had a really hard time with bars which she did really well with in L5. Same with floor so IMHO repeating is a good thing for competition experience while uptraining to 6. I know it's hard but try not to think of it like school where you move up to the next grade because you finished this grade. Gymnastics builds upon skills and mental toughness. You have to have a strong foundation to get the higher tricks. At least this is what I have learned in this journey with my Dd.

 

[Naty]

I agree with vagymmomma it is way better to repeat a level than to compete one than the girl does not feel comfortable doing it. And to feel comfortable competing the gymnast has to have numbers. Numbers of repetitions of skills and routines. She is gonna come stronger as a gymnast, with a huge bust to her self confidence after rocking level 5. My gymmie repeated level 5 (she was 7 year old her first season) and it was the best decision ever. She is now 11 and training level 9. Trust the coaches, repeating level 5 is not a bad thing.

 

[coachmolly]

She's only been working on level 6 skills for a month or so? My personal opinion is that if the coach expected them to have all of their level 6 skills by August, they would have started training them earlier. Picking up a lot of the level 6 skills is a long process for lots of kids, just in terms of increasing difficulty and the fear issues associated with quite a few of them.
Has the coach made decisions for all of the girls in regards to what level they will be competing in the fall? If it's a gym policy to evaluate all of the girls at X time and determine their level for the upcoming season, I would generally trust their opinion. But, if it's only your DD, it could also be the coach getting frustrated with her fear issues or trying to give her a kick in the pants to get her skills together. But, like CoachTodd mentioned, my views on this subject are also a little tainted.
For the right reasons, there is absolutely no shame in doing another season of level 5, it's a pretty common thing. And there is no sense pushing your DD beyond her limits to overcome her current fear issues, usually that just ends up backfiring sometime down the road. It all just comes down to your experiences with your coaches and how much you trust their judgements. I also think it's totally reasonable to ask them for a plan for your DD as you work your way into the fall. How will she mix level 5 and 6 training? Will there be an opportunity to move to level 6 if she gets the skills solidly? What about on only the events she is ready to compete? Can she just not compete until she is ready for level 6?
I know that some gyms are against a gymnast not competing at all because, especially at the compulsory levels, they see competition experience at any level as being very valuable. So in their eyes, that might not even be an option. I know the cost of it all is overwhelming, but the experience, even at a familiar level, could help your DD in the long run. A lot of kids also live for meets and get really motivated to improve, so the coaches could worry that without that source of motivation, your DD might not push herself as hard.
Just a few things to think about, but from my perspective, competing level 5 again, training level 6 and not competing, or competing only a few events as a level 6 are all perfectly acceptable options. If it were my choice, I would really take into consideration the personality of the child and how she will likely react to each of the above scenarios.

 

[kimskids]

I kind of get where you are coming from here as my daughter has been training with level 5's for the summer after skipping level 4. I was under the impression that if she got her kip she would compete level 5 and if not she would continue training with the level 5's but would compete level 4. She has had all the level 4 skills for a long time. Well my daughter got her kip a couple weeks ago but her coach still wants her to compete level 4. At first I was a bit confused but upon thinking it through I realized it would be a lot more stressful for her to try to get her kip looking good, etc. when she had just got the skill. I know she will score well in level 4 and she will still train with the level 5's so she can work on really getting her skills looking good. After having a great level 3 season I am sure rushing to compete level 5 and probably not scoring so great would be a bit discouraging. I think that sometime we parents like to see them advance quickly b/c we spend so much time and money on this sport when sometimes it is better to give them the time to strengthen the basic skills.
I would also see how your daughter feels about competing level 5 again....I know my daughter loves to compete and would be bummed to see all her teammates competing and not be able to whatever the level. Good luck with whatever happens!!

 

[lilgymmie7]

I would trust your DD's coaches to know what is best for her. They may see her fear issues as being a hinderance to her ability as a level 6 and realize she may get too stressed out through it all. Perhaps repeating level 5 will give her an added self-esteem booster because she will get to perfect her routines and score well. However, if you don't trust her coaches than that is an issue you need to resolve in some way.
My DD competed level 5 last season and went into the summer with the majority if not all of her level 6 skills. She may have to repeat 5 because that seems to be what the gym does on the norm. She did okay with a 35.875 at state, but clearly could do better. So repeating could also give her the confidence to go out and attack level 6 and 7 etc. in the future. My DD is a competitor. She loves competing, so not competing for her is not an option. You do have to see what makes your DD tick. If her coaches stated she would compete 5 but train with the level 6's while working 6 skills, then she will be challenged. That could be a great fit for your DD. As for mine that uptraining is quite consistent for DD. She works a lot of level 7 skills with her coaches, and at times is the only one doing a certain skill because she is ready for it. I asked DD how she felt if she had to repeat 5 and she shrugged her shoulder. I took it to mean like "I don't know...Okay." Ask your DD and go from there. After all she is the one that has to really contend with it all.
I look at it this way, DD is at a great, reputable gym with outstanding gymnasts. Her coaches pay enough attention to her that DD loves going to practice and hates to miss. I have seen repeaters of a level ALWAYS do well the second year, and they are left as a stronger gymnast in the end. That is what I want for DD. Now her coaches haven't actually said she would repeat, but if she does I know they have her best interest in mind and DD will benifit.
Assess your DD's situation and ask her what she wants to do keeping in mind that she HAS to work hard to progress and at times put her fears aside. I know your DD is young, 8. My DD is 7, she will turn 8 in January. She already knows what she wants to do. She is the gymnast you will see that works hard on a skill and then says from across the gym, " Hey Coach, watch, I think I got it....No, Okay hold on..." And she moves on to get it going. This is result of the coaching she gets at the gym. Trust her coaches. There are a lot more positive aspects to gain from gym than just progressing a level every year.

 

[sportzmomov3]

In addition to the perspectives others have already posted, please also consider how young your DD is and what rushing before she has truly mastered something really means for her (this isn't about you). Moving up isn't a right, it's earned by showing confidence and consistent execution of required skills. Gymnastics is not a race, it is a sport centered around perfection. At the risk of sounding harsh, scoring a 34.7 at States isn't usually a move-up score in our area. Our level 5 state champions in the 7/8 age group are scoring in the 37s/38s. To make top 10 at State you'd have to be scoring in the mid-high 36s. The fundamentals of the sport are introduced in the compulsory levels, so in order to succeed later on, mastery of the basic skills (things like kips, flyaways, front & back tumbling) is essential as it's a layered progression of skills with each step up in level. I also want to say that I disagree that repeating a level makes you "stagnant." This is again, a sport about perfection - you are always working towards making every movement, every skill, as perfect as possible - that's the real goal - not the scores, not the level. The scores will equate to the level of mastery and perfection in execution.

Finally, what's the point of competing a level when you're only good on 2 of the 4 events? Getting a skill is one thing, doing it confidently and consistently is another. Respect your coaches' decision. Repeating a level at this stage is not a big deal.

 

[lettrich]

Thanks for all yopur advice. I guess I am also concerned with her falling behind & not keeping up with her teammates. I spoke with the owner & coach today & they assured me they will continue to push her on the skills she is ready to do. I figure I will let her do a few level 5 meets & then re-eval how she is doing. I guess I just have to get over the feeling that she is not progressing.

 

[lhmom]

I agree. I did not do gymnastics and I trust that DD's coaches know what my DD needs. If DD was anxious and struggling on the next level skills, I would be fine with the coaches having her repeat a level. If your DD is struggling with a skill in practice, I would think it would be even harder for her to put it out there when feeling pressured during a meet. As long as they still have her uptraining, she's being challenged I would think. How is she feeling about it?

Well, I guess I was posting at the same time as the OP. Sounds like a good plan, lettrich! She'll get there, just takes time.

 

[sportzmomov3]

I'll say it another way: moving levels does not equate to progress. This is something you need to really embrace or you will lose your sanity in this sport. Progress is the display of confidence and consistent execution that coaches and judges look for. It's the mental toughness & maturity gained through this sport that should be your barometer, not what level your DD competes. Competition ready skills and "getting" a skill are very different. Ask any of the coaches on this board and they will define the differences.

At age 8, who is your DD "falling behind"? Based on my observation through the years, the majority of 8 yr olds are level 4 or 5. Given this, your DD is right on track even if she competes as a second year 9 yr old level 5. This is a tough sport and ultimately your DD's teammates may end up at different levels as they continue on - it's part of life and it's ok. Teammates are teammates regardless of age or level.

Let your DD be your guide in this journey and take cues from her. If she is showing fear over skills, it's not the time to push her coaches to have her compete a level up. It sends a message that this is about what you want, not what your DD wants or more importantly needs.

 

[ajanele]

Hi, I'm new to the forum too.

My daughter is also 8 and will also be repeating level 5 (for most of the season), and I couldn't be happier. She is going to be so well prepared this year, and her confidence will skyrocket. She is training her 6/7 skills now, so that way in another year she'll be more than prepared to compete.

If you're not happy with the gym there's no harm in looking around for a better fit, but I would really caution against pushing her to another gym with the sole intent of level mobility.

Good luck!

 

[MaryA]

From being on this site for about a year now, I have learned that level 5 is a pretty common year to repeat. And, as far as I'm concerned, fear is maybe one of the best reasons to repeat. One of the girls on my DD's team developed a back tumbling fear about half way through her level 5 season so the coaches really pushed the BHS HARD and what I saw was the skill get worse and worse the harder and harder they pushed. Repeating the level is a good way to give her the time she needs to take a step or two back and work up to the skill again, instead of forcing her to push through it, which I think just adds to anxiety. There is no "shame" in repeating a level, and, as long as the gym allows your daughter to uptrain, she will continue to progress at her skills and be that much more prepared for what's to come.

 

[gym law mom]

Thanks for all yopur advice. I guess I am also concerned with her falling behind & not keeping up with her teammates. I spoke with the owner & coach today & they assured me they will continue to push her on the skills she is ready to do. I figure I will let her do a few level 5 meets & then re-eval how she is doing. I guess I just have to get over the feeling that she is not progressing.

The thing is--she is progressing. Could she do the L6 beam routine a few months ago? My guess is no. Bars are just plain tough and cause many L6 girls to really struggle. If the coaches will continue to let her train L6 skills while she competes L5 then that is a good solution for this coming season. Its not just about getting skills, but also putting them into the routine and doing them well. The L6 bar routine should be done with flow from skill to skill which makes it even more of a challenge.
JMO, but you need to get out of the mindset that you will re-evaluate after a few meets. You are her mom and not the coach---be there and be supportive, but don't get in the middle of what she will or won't do this season. Your dd is in gymnastics to enjoiy the sport---you need to do that too.

 

[gymcoach34]

I have no problem with her not competing level 6 until she has the necessary skills. I have also told her that she can do 2 level 5 meets that are local until then. The coach said she will be learning the level 6 skills she is comfortable with & will also learn the routines. She can already do level 6 beam. I am just afraid if we let her do another whole year of 5 she will become complacent & not push herself to learn new skills. I am also fearful the coach will "give up on her" and not focus on her learning new skills.

The coaches know best. Why do you want to push her to do skills she afraid of at the age of 8? If she stays in gymnastics- she will have a lot of time that might look "stagnant" to you- doesnt mean its not important time or time well spent. Why not trust the coach, as they are the professionals? From what you wrote, it sould like they have your DD's best interest in mind.

If you think she wont push herself bc she is repeating a level, then she is not motivated enough for Level 6. Kids need to learn how to keep pushing forward in gymnastics-even when they dont get what they want. The coach is not going to give up on her- sounds like the coach is responsible and experienced- you are lucky.

Also, a 34 at states does not show mastery at level 5. My advice is to back off and let your daughter take this year to become more confinent and stronger. Does your gym let you pick what meets you do? That is crazy. If she was on my Level 5 team she would compete at all the L5 meets! This will be a great year for your DD if you let it be!

 

[drivingmom]

You daughter is young so there is no need to rush through the levels. A 34 at the end of the season is not very strong when they should be at their peak. I have to say your DD gym trains alot of hours compared to our 9 hours a week. Our gym requires 2 scores of 36 to move up and all your skills. One of my DD's repeated level 4 and it really ended up being a fantasic year for her. She scored 36 - 38's at all meets and was so ready for level 5 she had a great year. So repeating will build confidence and her skills so she is ready for level 6, which is a really tough level. I would not want my DD to progress until she is doing her current level well. Each level layers on the previous level. At 8 I would not even bat an eye at repeating level 5.

I have learned to trust her coach (as long it's a good one)! Good luck to you and your DD.