Women New Regions?

[gymfan1]

Recently there was an article from college gym news that addressed the empty spots at DP nationals depending on the region. In the article, they rearranged the regions in a way that they believe would be more fair. Keeping in mind that it is in no way official, how would we feel about this if it was changed?

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[gym_dad32608]

I mean it seems reasonable. Just dont know that having a region not fill all their slots is such a problem that merits changes?

 

[bookworm]

This is brought up every year … usually by regions feeling that they have somehow been wronged by folks living, and qualifying to Nationals, in less gymnast populated regions …

 

[GymnastMomX2]

I think this makes a lot of sense, they recently redid the mens regions, why not the women’s?

I also think they could just do away with the regional competition at nationals and go by %. It would mean regions would be uneven at nationals, but it would be more fair individuality. I don’t seem them doing this.

I mean it seems reasonable. Just dont know that having a region not fill all their slots is such a problem that merits changes?

I think the problem lies with some girls in region 2 with a min score of a 35 are able to call themselves a national qualifier, then you have girls in other regions scoring a 37+ who don’t qualify. A region 2 girl has way less stress at regionals, maybe she is capable of scoring 37+ but there’s only 4 girls in her age group. She has a bad day and falls a few times, still gets to go to nationals, gets the experience, gets in front of college coaches, etc.

Am I wrong in thinking being able to call yourself a national qualifier helps with college recruiting? Or does it not matter as much as I’m thinking?

 

[bookworm]

I think the problem lies with some girls in region 2 with a min score of a 35 are able to call themselves a national qualifier, then you have girls in other regions scoring a 37+ who don’t qualify. A region 2 girl has way less stress at regionals, maybe she is capable of scoring 37+ but there’s only 4 girls in her age group. She has a bad day and falls a few times, still gets to go to nationals, gets the experience, gets in front of college coaches, etc.

This is EXACTLY what I am referring to and after 20 years , nothing changes ....the Region 2 National Qualifier is a National Qualifier from her region and people need to stop "region shaming" (for lack of a better word) ...there are probably many more powerhouse gyms or even looser judging in some regions that "girls with a 37+ don't qualify" ...I just looked at our regional scores (and ours used to be a stingy region) and 37s went down to 9th place ...so stop this. If you want your kid to have the same"advantage" as living in Region 2 , move there... but please stop trying to diminish the accomplishments of those in smaller regions.

 

[GymnastMomX2]

Wasn’t trying to region shame, just explaining why I’m in support of reshuffling which states are in each region to try and make things more fair.

 

[ORgymmom]

This is EXACTLY what I am referring to and after 20 years , nothing changes ....the Region 2 National Qualifier is a National Qualifier from her region and people need to stop "region shaming" (for lack of a better word) ...there are probably many more powerhouse gyms or even looser judging in some regions that "girls with a 37+ don't qualify" ...I just looked at our regional scores (and ours used to be a stingy region) and 37s went down to 9th place ...so stop this. If you want your kid to have the same"advantage" as living in Region 2 , move there... but please stop trying to diminish the accomplishments of those in smaller regions.

This is good advice. Definitely move here. And build a ton more gyms, please.

Yes, region 2 has fewer gymnasts. But it also has limited access to gyms and gymnastics relative to every other region. Gymnasts here are often making every single meet into at least an overnight, even at levels 2 and 3, because even “local” meets are a 2-hour drive away in tough weather or terrible traffic. Have you had to consult a ferry schedule to plan your drive to a meet? Would you like to? Come to region 2!

It’s always fascinating to hear families in regions with lots of gyms debating which direction they should drive to access a better gym for their child. Here, it’s more like, are you even in driving distance of any gym, and did you get on a waitlist when your child was 3? No? Then no gym for you. Even in populated areas there are far fewer gyms than is typical.

 

[gym_dad32608]

Am I wrong in thinking being able to call yourself a national qualifier helps with college recruiting? Or does it not matter as much as I’m thinking?

No, I dont think it has as much influence as folks think in college recruiting. I mean it certainly doesn't hurt. But it only matters in the context of the body of work through the season. So if you had been scoring 36s all season and then through some twist you do well and have a get a nationals slot, colleges arent going to suddenly put you on their list. By the same token if you had been scoring 38s all season and had an uncharacteristic regional fall or injury and don't make nationals, you still are going to be attractive to colleges.

 

[josie55]

@GymnastMomX2 makes a fair point, and there is good reason this topic comes up every year, and that it’s now being covered by the gymnastics press. It’s not “region shaming” (last I saw region two has some of the strongest gyms in the nation.) It’s about a competition that holds tremendous prestige, and may have long-term consequences for some, being structured in a way that is so obviously not balanced. It’s a very fair question to ask, and just because those of us who have been on this platform for many years have discussed the topic before, doesn’t mean people shouldn’t be raising the question.

 

[GymnastMomX2]

Also perhaps instead of highlighting score differences between regions I should have pointed out % differences like the article does. 90%+ qualifying in one region vs. 50% or less in others in not even close to equitable.

 

[bookworm]

Wasn’t trying to region shame, just explaining why I’m in support of reshuffling which states are in each region to try and make things more fair.

But that’s the thing …… Texas could have its own region with the amount of gymnasts they have and like ORgymmom says , region 2 tends to have less gyms and therefore less gymnasts because of where they are but flipping Oregon into Region 6 for example might make your numbers look better but the whole “regional competition “ would be gone. Would a “national qualifying set of scores “ (i.e. get 4 scores of 38+ at any meet and you go to Nationals) be a solution? Im not sure because you’d probably get sky high scores that weren’t “real” to help kids qualify… i dont know… i just know that every year we went, and we went for 10 years total between both my girls, the best gymnasts in the country were there.

 

[GymnastMomX2]

But that’s the thing …… Texas could have its own region with the amount of gymnasts they have and like ORgymmom says , region 2 tends to have less gyms and therefore less gymnasts because of where they are but flipping Oregon into Region 6 for example might make your numbers look better but the whole “regional competition “ would be gone. Would a “national qualifying set of scores “ (i.e. get 4 scores of 38+ at any meet and you go to Nationals) be a solution? Im not sure because you’d probably get sky high scores that weren’t “real” to help kids qualify… i dont know… i just know that every year we went, and we went for 10 years total between both my girls, the best gymnasts in the country were there.

How would the regional competition be gone based on the proposed regions in the article, the regions are still there, just some states have been shuffled around?

I don't like the idea of a min set of scores, only because you'd get a lot of people crying that the judging wasn't the same, and I get that, it likely wouldn't be the same. A 38 in one region might not be the same in another, we see this issue across conferences in college. I think you're right, we would start to see more inflated scores in certain regions so they could qualify more girls. (honestly, this is semi related, but IMO the scores at the Texas state meet this year were super inflated, especially vault, its like they were trying to get more girls to regionals... or maybe everyone had a good vault day lol)

I disagree that the best gymnasts in the country are at nationals, I think the best gymnasts in each region are at nationals, and there-in lies the problem, the number of gymnasts per region isn't even lose to equal.

 

[gymfan1]

I think you're right, we would start to see more inflated scores in certain regions so they could qualify more girls. (honestly, this is semi related, but IMO the scores at the Texas state meet this year were super inflated, especially vault, its like they were trying to get more girls to regionals... or maybe everyone had a good vault day lol)

im honestly so sick of inflated scores, whatever the circumstance, for club and college

 

[bookworm]

How would the regional competition be gone based on the proposed regions in the article, the regions are still there, just some states have been shuffled around?

I don't like the idea of a min set of scores, only because you'd get a lot of people crying that the judging wasn't the same, and I get that, it likely wouldn't be the same. A 38 in one region might not be the same in another, we see this issue across conferences in college. I think you're right, we would start to see more inflated scores in certain regions so they could qualify more girls. (honestly, this is semi related, but IMO the scores at the Texas state meet this year were super inflated, especially vault, its like they were trying to get more girls to regionals... or maybe everyone had a good vault day lol)

I disagree that the best gymnasts in the country are at nationals, I think the best gymnasts in each region are at nationals, and there-in lies the problem, the number of gymnasts per region isn't even lose to equal.

Agree to disagree because every time we went the best gymnasts that went on to Olympic teams or to be NCAA powerhouses were there … was there someone who might not have made it ? Sure but in general, the best were there.

And your realignment of states would totally take away the regional aspect because regions with less gymnasts would be sent elsewhere or regions with a lot, would somehow be all in Region 2 .

 

[JBS]

Just linking this one in here too...

A

Anon Yes Nationals Matters for Recruiting

Wednesday at 9:41 AM

Of course the very top gymnasts will get recruited regardless, but the suggestion that DP Nationals “doesn’t really matter that much for college recruiting,” is just wrong.

First off, ANY level of influence is meaningful for something as important as recruiting. Second, it’s another chance to compete, which always matters for recruiting. Third, it’s a chance to compete in a meet that is highly credible/where scores are very legit. In fact, collegegymfans says they base their rankings almost entire off of Nationals.

Finally, it’s a chance to be seen in person. Speaking from experience...

• Anonymous (92c8)
• recruiting
• Replies: 33
• Forum: Anonymous Posting

• 

 

[JBS]

Basically this would have to become a "thing"... redistricting or "re-regionaling". Everything else is lined up on 4 or 8 years in USAG... so pick one of those and state that this shuffling happens automatically based on current numbers every 8 or 16 years or something like that.

If there was no system behind it like... "I just want to do it because we have too many good kids in our region"... then whatever. Create a system so everyone knows that it happens every so often regardless with rules that dictate how it will happen... then there you go.

Another thing to remember is the "money" involved. Moving a large state to a different region can affect the number of gymnasts that attend meets in the surrounding states. Individual meet profits could shift by tens of thousands of dollars based on this concept. Not that I am considering this at all... but there may be people out there on regional boards that run big meets... actually... there may be many of them.

 

[Dahlialover]

I’m in Region 2 on the Men’s side and they just added 7 states to our region. Old region 2 was WA, OR, ID, MT, AK and they added ND, SD, MN, WY, CO, NB, IA!!! Our region now spans 4 time zones and, instead of regionals being drivable for the majority of participants, it now requires a plane flight and hotel for the majority. They told us that the consolidation would provide “more resources” but all we got out of it was 1000s of dollars in unnecessary travel expenses and the elimination of level 3 and 4 from Regionals. I’m not sure who this change was meant to benefit because it sure wasn’t the athletes!

 

[GymnastMomX2]

instead of regionals being drivable for the majority of participants, it now requires a plane flight and hotel for the majority

I’ve only once been lucky enough to be close enough to drive to regionals, and that’s when it was in my home state. I think this is already the case for many regions.

I’m also not familiar with the reasoning behind why the men’s regions changed?

 

[3rd_time_around]

But that’s the thing …… Texas could have its own region with the amount of gymnasts they have and like ORgymmom says , region 2 tends to have less gyms and therefore less gymnasts because of where they are but flipping Oregon into Region 6 for example might make your numbers look better but the whole “regional competition “ would be gone. Would a “national qualifying set of scores “ (i.e. get 4 scores of 38+ at any meet and you go to Nationals) be a solution? Im not sure because you’d probably get sky high scores that weren’t “real” to help kids qualify… i dont know… i just know that every year we went, and we went for 10 years total between both my girls, the best gymnasts in the country were there.

Florida could also have their own region.

 

[GymnastMomX2]

Another thing to remember is the "money" involved. Moving a large state to a different region can affect the number of gymnasts that attend meets in the surrounding states.

I’m confused by this comment, do gyms only choose meets within their region? We do two travel meets a year, both in random, different regions, and then the rest of our meets are in-state. A region re-shuffle would only potentially change the location for a regional meet, not other meets. Maybe other gyms handle meets differently? I just didn’t realize that was a thing.