Parents No score out for level 5?

[JBS]

Great news... Level 5 is no longer required if you score two 36's at Level 4. See the exact details in the following link...

https://static.usagym.org/PDFs/Women/Committee%20Minutes/NDPC/ndpc_051523.pdf

What do you think... join in the conversation below!

 

[SryouMom]

Anyone heard of a gymnast not needing to score out of level 5 if they scored a 36 or higher at two or more meets when competing level 4? My daughters gym (and most gyms around us) compete level 4 and 6, skipping level 5 season by scoring out at one meet over the summer. DD had her score out last month. A friend of hers, that goes to another gym close by, said that she just found out that she will no longer have to do her planned score out meet next month because she scored a 36 at two level 4 meets. Wondering if this is true. My daughter and most of her teammates scored that during their level 4 season, and they all had to participate in the level 5 score out in order to move up to 6. Would USAG change this requirement in the middle the year? If its true my DD feels like its unfair because now other teams don’t have to spend the time hers did leaning level 5 routines.

 

[Mish]

I may be wrong, but I think the rule on this just recently changed to allow this.

 

[Carly]

https://static.usagym.org/PDFs/Women/Committee Minutes/NDPC/ndpc_051523.pdf
Looks like the rule was changed in May.

 

[SryouMom]

https://static.usagym.org/PDFs/Women/Committee Minutes/NDPC/ndpc_051523.pdf
Looks like the rule was changed in May.

Thanks! Guess that was slow news to get out since my daughters gym still did a score out and another gym close by planned to do theirs up until the other day.

 

[JBS]

It's honestly really hard to keep up with the rules. This is a great new rule... but I wouldn't say it was highly publicized.

 

[Aussie_coach]

It seems like a positive change in many ways. With so many gyms choosing to score out of 5 to go straight to 6. It saves a lot of time and hassle, learning the level 5 routines just to do them once to score out.

That time could be better spent in skill development.

 

[gymgal]

Not sure I am understanding why a score in a lower level would "prove" the ability to skip the next level. I understand that L5 and 6 are essentially the same requirements so I get the skipping 5 for 6. but why the 36 requirement in 4?

 

[GymDad00]

Seems like USAG doesn't want anyone competing Level 5 anymore with all the rule changes.

I mean, it's notoriously known as a humbling level for scoring. I've seen a lot of level 4s drop a full 2 points in AA moving up to 5. Lot's of small text deductions for the judges to have a field day with. It was always the smallest field for states in our area, but now it's kinda becoming a "what's the point?" level in a gymnasts journey. I guess it could become the level people participate in to get an easier shot at a state championship because all the burgeoning elites and competitive college track gymnasts will skip it moving forward. I wouldn't be shocked to see a 35 AA win a state championship in level 5 in the coming years in some of the tougher scoring regions.

 

[GymDadWA]

Seems like USAG doesn't want anyone competing Level 5 anymore with all the rule changes.

I mean, it's notoriously known as a humbling level for scoring. I've seen a lot of level 4s drop a full 2 points in AA moving up to 5. Lot's of small text deductions for the judges to have a field day with. It was always the smallest field for states in our area, but now it's kinda becoming a "what's the point?" level in a gymnasts journey. I guess it could become the level people participate in to get an easier shot at a state championship because all the burgeoning elites and competitive college track gymnasts will skip it moving forward. I wouldn't be shocked to see a 35 AA win a state championship in level 5 in the coming years in some of the tougher scoring regions.

At least in our area it feels like compulsories as a whole is something gyms don't want to compete.

Many gyms are doing XB > XS > XG > XP/DP4 > DP6.

I wouldn't be surprised if we see something like a 36AA in two meets for XP would qualify for DP6 and the whole DP 1-5 being presented as a parallel path to XB-XP where a gym could do either pathway.

 

[JBS]

Compulsory levels in the women's program take a lot of work to win / place well. The trend in gymnastics is definitely starting to swing towards more realistic hours for each level. Realistic hours definitely work to progress towards optional levels... but they don't work if your goal is to beat the 20 hour per week Level 4's.

 

[Coach Kate]

Compulsory levels in the women's program take a lot of work to win / place well. The trend in gymnastics is definitely starting to swing towards more realistic hours for each level. Realistic hours definitely work to progress towards optional levels... but they don't work if your goal is to beat the 20 hour per week Level 4's.

This is a really good way of putting it. I coached DP years ago, and I remember being so annoyed with the head coach's pressure to win at level 2 state, which was a full month after sectionals. I had to sit there and nit pick routines when we could have been building progressions for the level three skills. That HC didn't think you were doing a good job unless the kids were getting 38s. Nailing the compulsory routines takes time, and would that time be better spent in ballet learning how to actually dance? Maybe.

 

[gymgal]

At least in our area it feels like compulsories as a whole is something gyms don't want to compete.

Many gyms are doing XB > XS > XG > XP/DP4 > DP6.

I wouldn't be surprised if we see something like a 36AA in two meets for XP would qualify for DP6 and the whole DP 1-5 being presented as a parallel path to XB-XP where a gym could do either pathway.

I said 10 years ago that the compulsory program was on its way out. It still hasn't happened but it is getting closer. There's just no need to have compulsory routines. More gyms across the country are using the xcel system to bypass compulsory and train successful optional gymnasts. USAG easily could create an optional program with requirements and deductions to address the needs of the L2-5 development standards. They already allow a small amount of choice in skills. They would just need to expand this and allow individualized routines. I also think this would be an answer to a true split between xcel and DP, as there would be no need for gyms to compete their DP girls in the xcel program.

 

[JBS]

Great conversation going on at our Gymnastics Parents Facebook Group too... be sure to join the group if you are a parent...

Gymnastics Parents | Facebook

Moms & Dads with a child in the sport of gymnastics!

www.facebook.com

 

[3rd_time_around]

Anyone heard of a gymnast not needing to score out of level 5 if they scored a 36 or higher at two or more meets when competing level 4? My daughters gym (and most gyms around us) compete level 4 and 6, skipping level 5 season by scoring out at one meet over the summer. DD had her score out last month. A friend of hers, that goes to another gym close by, said that she just found out that she will no longer have to do her planned score out meet next month because she scored a 36 at two level 4 meets. Wondering if this is true. My daughter and most of her teammates scored that during their level 4 season, and they all had to participate in the level 5 score out in order to move up to 6. Would USAG change this requirement in the middle the year? If its true my DD feels like its unfair because now other teams don’t have to spend the time hers did leaning level 5 routines.

USAG years run from Aug 1 to July 31, so it’s actually the beginning of the year.

 

[3rd_time_around]

It's honestly really hard to keep up with the rules. This is a great new rule... but I wouldn't say it was highly publicized.

It doesn’t take effect until Aug 1, and they wait until Congresses start befor announcing new rules. It will definitely get to be known before the fall season starts.

 

[3rd_time_around]

Thanks! Guess that was slow news to get out since my daughters gym still did a score out and another gym close by planned to do theirs up until the other day.

It starts Aug 1, it’s not slow to get out, it just wasn’t time yet. They announce rule changes in the summer at Congresses.

 

[3rd_time_around]

I said 10 years ago that the compulsory program was on its way out. It still hasn't happened but it is getting closer. There's just no need to have compulsory routines. More gyms across the country are using the xcel system to bypass compulsory and train successful optional gymnasts. USAG easily could create an optional program with requirements and deductions to address the needs of the L2-5 development standards. They already allow a small amount of choice in skills. They would just need to expand this and allow individualized routines. I also think this would be an answer to a true split between xcel and DP, as there would be no need for gyms to compete their DP girls in the xcel program.

I like compulsories. Each level builds on the one before it. They train root skills needed for all skills. My daughter didn’t do level 5 because after Covid they switched to Gold and did one score out meet for 5. It shows now in her skills, because she missed that year of intense training on free hips and fly always. The back extension roll on floor is the same movement as a free hop, so it reinforces the free hip training in 2 events. I actually was hoping they would make it mandatory to do 2 score out meets in both 4 and 5, but this is what happened Instead. I don’t think a 36 is high enough, though, that’s just my opinion, since my own daughter was able to score that but it didn’t translate to success in level 6.

 

[gymgal]

I like compulsories. Each level builds on the one before it. They train root skills needed for all skills. My daughter didn’t do level 5 because after Covid they switched to Gold and did one score out meet for 5. It shows now in her skills, because she missed that year of intense training on free hips and fly always. The back extension roll on floor is the same movement as a free hop, so it reinforces the free hip training in 2 events. I actually was hoping they would make it mandatory to do 2 score out meets in both 4 and 5, but this is what happened Instead. I don’t think a 36 is high enough, though, that’s just my opinion, since my own daughter was able to score that but it didn’t translate to success in level 6.

every level builds on the one before. Compulsory routines are not needed for that. You make the assumption that just because a skill or progression is not in the routine that it won't be trained, which is simply not true.

 

[3rd_time_around]

every level builds on the one before. Compulsory routines are not needed for that. You make the assumption that just because a skill or progression is not in the routine that it won't be trained, which is simply not true.

I’m not making any assumptions. I stated my OPINION based on fact and knowledge of the compulsory program and why they have it. But mostly my opinion after having my 3 daughters come through the lower levels and seeing the different paths they took and how not training level 5 for a whole season negatively impacted my 3rd daughter’s optional training and performance. And every level does not build on the one before, because Xcel gymnasts can skip skills and just do what’s easiest for them as long as the requirements for their level are met.
Example: backwards roll, to back ext roll in push-up position, to back ext roll to kneeling, to back extension roll to handstand Step down. That’s 4 levels, each building on the one before, training that core skill for 4-5 years, the purpose of which is to strengthen their free hip in levels 5 and above, as it’s the same movement and shape. My youngest missed the final step, didn’t do free hips in Gold or back extension rolls, trained it just before scoring out of 5 and squeaking by with it, and then struggled with it for the next 2 years. My OPINION based on my knowledge and observation and experience.