Parents How to be competitive when you are against teams that hold girls back a year or two?

[emandelsmom]

We were in a neighboring state this weekend. The girls competited Sunday. The ones in the level 4 group that took home the medals were BEAUTIFUL. Elegant. Gorgous gymnasts. They deserved what they won. Come to find out, some of the girls were repetiting level 4 for the third year. Seriously. Training 6 in the gym but competiting four. Like I said, they were gorgous. Daughter never stood a chance. How does a first year level four compete against third year level fours? Em did awesome and completed all events with no falls or major mistakes. She just does not have that finesse yet. She will probably do four again to help gain that beauty of it since she really just "got" her skills in October. It won't hurt her. But truly none of level fours did well against that. Anyone else up against this?

 

[Monkeygirlsmom]

well If they have high scores and can do the next level I think def should move up! but like my younger dd her scores are not very high and also she has not gotten any level 5 skills she is a kid that needs to stay level 4 and next year she will probably be a level 4 again! but like I said she is not a good scorer!

 

[flipper's fan]

There are gyms everywhere that do this. I must say that it gets under my skin when girls score 37 and 38 AA in the first meet of the season and stay on that level all season and for states. What is the point? What are those medals worth if you know you are crushing the girls at a lower level than you are capable of competing? I am also not so sure I'd want to be paying the gym for 8 or 9 years of compulsory gymnastics. It's taking advantage of the parent too.

 

[emandelsmom]

These girls were scoring things like 9.8's on all events. I think one even got a 9.9. Our coaches talked to their coaches and found this out as well as some of the girls are friends with each other on facebook. Like I said they were beautiful to watch. The did the deserve those scores. My husband said it would be like putting Em at level 2 and having her compete it. Easy breezy for her to do it and win and score very high.

 

[gym law mom]

Unfortunately, you'll come up against sandbaggers in most sports. Thing is there is no rule to prevent it. You would think the kids and parents would get sick of doing the same level and either push to move up or go to another gym that will put them at a higher level, but some get so caught up in "winning" that they go along with it.
All you can do is encourage your dd to do her best and keep having fun.

 

[Gymnasticgrandkids]

Unfortunately it happens...my DGD competed one season where the girl from the other gym had all she could do to contain herself from doing all the upskills she had...she competed L5 and went to state competing it and of course won everything, then the next season she scored out of L6, L7 and started competing L8 that same season where she still scored high 37's...at L8...so again, it happens, why I don't know, but it does.

 

[sportzmomov3]

Compulsory moms everywhere: forget about the scores. It's really about learning skills with the proper technique and executing perfect form. Meets are really just a way for the girls to show off their hard work and get experience with competition. You should not even ponder comparisons - of course you would expect a gymnast who is repeating a level to do better than a first year, but on the flip side, not all repeating gymnasts do better - just perspective.

As a mom to an optional gymnast, I will be honest and tell you that I felt as you did back then - annoyed that gyms would "hold back" girls just for high scores. My DD was not a beautiful compulsory gymnast. But I quickly realized that it doesn't really matter as long as my DD is still passionate about her sport (she definitely is) and she's progressing at a speed that's right for her (she is). My DD has taken the slow and steady path and she's a beautiful optional gymnast (not that I'm biased or anything).

So just sit back during the season and enjoy the progress that your DD is making, without looking at anyone else's score - you'll have a much better experience, I promise!

 

[MdGymMom01]

I am so grateful and happy that my dd's league (MDL) has changed the rules in the last year regarding this very topic. The new rule is that if any gymnast scores 36.00+AA in 2 out of the first 3 meets they MUST move up to the next level or opt out of awards. This is the first year they are doing it and it is wonderful!!! There were some kids scoring 36+'s at the very first couple meets so now they will be forced out of that level and on to the next. This gives the kids who are scoring 33's and 34's a chance to feel what is like to get on the podium. And plus, the Mason Dixon league is supposed to be about fairness and having fun, and NOT so much about the competitiveness of it all. It is a godsend for my dd who struggles with fear issues and does not want to devote her childhood years to training in the gym.

 

[Gymnasticgrandkids]

Liking that change in MDGymMom01's league. Early on we had heard that in our state they were going to take the top (I don't remember the number or percentage) of gymnasts from the season and they were going to be competing against each other and the rest would do as normal but it never happened. I believe that our state is trying to figure out some way to make it fun for all but they decided that that particular option would not work out. Sounds like MDL is working.

 

[lhmom]

At DD's gym, level 4 is usually 2 years, unless the coaches feel strongly that the child needs to go on. There is one of my daughter's teammates who will be doing this- she is 10 and has caught on to the skills quickly (even doing level 5 skills easily). No need to wait. I get the impression that my daughter's coaches have the 2nd year 4's as "leaders" for the 1st years. The 1st year girls learn a lot from watching the 2nd year girls and seems to put less stress on the 1st year girls during competitions. I know that my daughter learned a lot from her 2nd year teammates and that's pushed her towards improving. When they get to level 5, they usually stay 1 year then 2 years at level 6. My daughter's coaches are also fanatical about correct form and feel that when they are young, they often need that 2 years at level 4 to really "get it". I'm just speaking for my daughter's gym, of course. I agree with gigglesmom as well. I'm just proud to see my daughter's improvement with each meet. She has come a long way in 7 months! The scores, I don't dwell on, mainly because I still haven't figured what the judges are looking at. Ignorance is bliss, I suppose.

 

[NGL780309]

I don't know the ages of these girls, but I know for my DD that she scored right under a 36 in her first meet as a level 4 with a fall on bars, but she just turned 6 so there's no where else for her to go. I wouldn't like being forced to move on to the next level once you score a 36 AA because that would mean she couldn't compete and just because you score a 36 doesn't mean you have the skills for the next level. She's training level 5 and has most of her level 5 skills and I would hate for anyone to think we are holding her back just to win. She'll have to compete level 4 next fall during the comp. season. Now I don't see her scoring 38's so perhaps there's no worry.

DD's team experienced some of these 3rd year level 4's this past seasons. One girl scored a 9.8 on every single event. She was in the Jr C age division so I know she was old enough to move on. The only thing I could think of was that perhaps she's missing skills for level 5. Maybe she can't kip consistently or something. Or perhaps the coach just likes to win. I'd be taking my DD somewhere else. Who wants to keep working level 4 for that long?

 

[AGM78910]

Mariposa posted this:
USAG "Spirit of Good Sportsmanship"

http://www.usa-gymnastics.org/PDFs/W..._2010_0510.pdf

Recommendation to adopt the following statement and add to the 2010‐11 Rules and Policies and the
2013 Compulsory Book.
Motion: B. Harris
Second: J. Geddert
PASSED
In the spirit of good sportsmanship, fairness to all athletes and competitive balance, the mobility system within the National JO Program should be followed in the manner that it was intended.
- Before moving up a level, every athlete should show proficiency at their current level.
- Once a high level of proficiency is achieved at the athlete’s current level, she should strive to move up
to the next level as long as it is done safely.
- For athletes to repeat a level with the intent to gain an advantage over other competitors or teams IS NOT in the spirit of the JO Program or youth sports in general.

 

[Kiwi]

New Zealand Gymnastics has just put in a whole new system of 'steps' (instead of levels) and I think as part of the new system they have a rule where if you score more than a certain amount you have to move up. I think it is based on your average AA score. There is a also a minimum score you must achieve in order to be allowed to move up, that is, if you score less than that amount you will have to repeat the step because you obviously don't have proficiency in the skills yet.

 

[3rd_time_around]

I am so grateful and happy that my dd's league (MDL) has changed the rules in the last year regarding this very topic. The new rule is that if any gymnast scores 36.00+AA in 2 out of the first 3 meets they MUST move up to the next level or opt out of awards. This is the first year they are doing it and it is wonderful!!! There were some kids scoring 36+'s at the very first couple meets so now they will be forced out of that level and on to the next. This gives the kids who are scoring 33's and 34's a chance to feel what is like to get on the podium. And plus, the Mason Dixon league is supposed to be about fairness and having fun, and NOT so much about the competitiveness of it all. It is a godsend for my dd who struggles with fear issues and does not want to devote her childhood years to training in the gym.

I love this rule!! There is at least one gym in our state that holds girls back for 2-3 years just so they can win state at that level. I have this info from a mom who moved to our gym from that one. Her dd was on lvl 3 for 3 years! They hold back 4-6 girls who can score a 38 AA so that their compulsory levels are the state champs in every level, every year. So they can brag about it! Personally, I would never pay for that kind of gymnastics. It becomes more about the gym and the gym winning than the individual gymnasts and their progression and abilities. The girls are so old by the time they get to optionals, that a lot of them drop out or never make it to the level that colleges are looking at. If my daughter is scoring 38s at a compulsory level, by golly she better get moved up!!

But, it is hard for the girls on other teams to compete against teams that hold girls back. It is discouraging to score a 9.4 and only get 6th place. (when my dd was level 6, there was a 13 yr old from that gym who placed first in every event and AA at every meet that season. We heard it was her 3rd year on level 6! Her AA scores were amazing--38s and 39s. But I felt sorry for her. That gave her only 4 years left to reach level 10 and be competitive at that level.)

 

[sally]

Just wondering do they have a rule that if they get a high enough score to pass the level that they have to move up automatically?

 

[mariposa]

You really can't be competitive against that. Like I tell my daughter, gymnastics isn't always fair. You do the best you can at that meet and can't worry about the competition. We see it here, too. Really irritating, but nothing you can do about it, so you just let it go and move on.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

At DD's gym, level 4 is usually 2 years, unless the coaches feel strongly that the child needs to go on. There is one of my daughter's teammates who will be doing this- she is 10 and has caught on to the skills quickly (even doing level 5 skills easily). No need to wait. I get the impression that my daughter's coaches have the 2nd year 4's as "leaders" for the 1st years. The 1st year girls learn a lot from watching the 2nd year girls and seems to put less stress on the 1st year girls during competitions. I know that my daughter learned a lot from her 2nd year teammates and that's pushed her towards improving. When they get to level 5, they usually stay 1 year then 2 years at level 6. My daughter's coaches are also fanatical about correct form and feel that when they are young, they often need that 2 years at level 4 to really "get it". I'm just speaking for my daughter's gym, of course. I agree with gigglesmom as well. I'm just proud to see my daughter's improvement with each meet. She has come a long way in 7 months! The scores, I don't dwell on, mainly because I still haven't figured what the judges are looking at. Ignorance is bliss, I suppose.

whew...it is nice to know that i'm not the only one out there. and i'm a coach!

 

[Panda-girl's Mom]

I agree with the others there is nothing you can do just focus on your daughter. Every gym is different and my daughter has competed againest gyms like this. When you are new to the sport it is very discouraging and frustrating but after a while you stop worrying about it. It is sad because alot of these girls probally get bored and quit before they become optionals.

 

[AGM78910]

I agree with Panda-girls mom! She is totally right about gymnasts leaving. Case in point: We took DD out of a gym that repeated gymnasts at the compulsory levels for three years to get great scores at the State meets. There were over 75 level 4s and 5s when we left. Now, their optional team only has about 10 girls total from levels 7-10.

 

[Megley]

I agree with others that you need to just focus on your child and her improvement. We have a gym in the area that has girls repeat compulsory levels and I can tell you that, although they win compulsories every year, it all comes out in the wash at optionals. They are not any better than any other team at the optional levels (and in fact another team that does not repeat usually wins at Level 8 - 10) and they lose a lot of girls who never make it to optionals. It's hard to swallow when your dd is a Level 5 competing against girls who are doing their second or third year of the level, but it all evens out later when they get into the upper optional levels.