WAG What is the physical limit of skills? Where will WAG plateau?

[Deleted member D3987]

and not to be redundant, but i had the greatest childhood that anyone could ever have. i am still friends with many of those still living in these videos. this was my upbringing. santa monica, ft. lauderdale and the jersey shore. we were famous and crowds would look forward to us making our rounds each year.

this is the part that is hard to convey to parents when they ask about if gymnastics, or sports in general, are worth it. as i have posted before, i have no regrets and i wouldn't change 1 thing. my childhood was the epitome of nirvana and without any drugs or alcohol i might add.

we all were the "anti" of what was taking place during the 60's & 70's. i was between the age of 15 and 22 in several of these old videos. they are not in order year wise. our "high" was precisely what you see in these videos. got that? all of you kids that read here?

 

[wandrewsjr]

^^^ No fair, dunno! How can any of us speak with authority to anything gymnastics when you post videos of some of the coolest gymnastics EVER, some of it done by YOU! Show-off!!

 

[wandrewsjr]

it's never about entertainment with FIG. in fact, everything they do is antithetical to said same. it's always about safety and the development of the sport. as i said, Yurchenkos were being performed before they became official and before the introduction of the "tongue" or table. then the Julissa Gomez accident took place in Japan at Chunichi. the new table was forced/rushed in to existence. and rightfully so.

and again, the Korbut, and she had several skills named after her, was not the back flip from the feet that was banned due to safety. this skill was banned because FIG did not want uneven bars to go the direction of the circus. the back bend from high to low was banned because of safety. i regret if i did not convey this clearly.

and vault was always entertaining. Prudonova for 1. handspring double front. Produnova 1999 University Games Double Front Vault - YouTube

Natalia Yurchenko, Amanar and Lillia Podkopayeva all did their "name" vaults on the old vault horse. it was "entertaining" but became to dangerous for "normal" kids not of the Elite biological ilk. understand??

and arabian 1 3/4 were "desirable" to watch but they broke backs. so again, banned because of safety.

and by the way, i luuuuuuuuvvvvvve Prudonova.

My all-time favorite video of a female gymnast. Prudonova is such a bad-a**(excuse my language, but it is the best word I can think of to decribe her)

 

[Deleted member D3987]

i keep telling everyone...i had the greatest childhood! Dale Hart, Homer Sardenas, Mark Davis, Neil Schmidt...the circus acts that we performed in, the Nissen tours...the list is endless.

 

[txgymfan]

Those pools look way way to shallow for what you are doing. You must have given your mother a heart attack a hundred times over. I admire her for her fortitude dealing with you. However, the tricks were awesome and look like tons of fun!

 

[Deleted member D3987]

and that was the backyard pool (this end was deeper than you find today but not as deep as the trampoline end although i don't remember how deep. i don't recall 'hitting' bottom) of one of our friends/gymnasts from either UCLA or Cal State. his dad let us 'set up' everything so that we could screw around and show off to all the girls you see at pool side. many of them were gymnasts also. you can see a couple of girls try stuff. they weren't trained in conditioning the same way they are today.

and it was a different time. my parents had NO IDEA the craziness of what you see. LOL.

 

[M&G'sMom]

Okay, Dunno, so then you think WAG won't have any changes in equipment until girls start doing really dangerous things on the equipment? So, really, if the elite coaches are worth their salt, they will put their own limits on the sport out of fear for their gymnasts' safety? It takes a "bad" coach letting his gymnasts perform skills that are obviously too dangerous on the current equipment for FIG to make a change to that equipment, basically rewarding the bad coaches for their reckless behavior by making a huge change to the very makeup of the sport to accommodate their risks? Someone has to get paralyzed in a meet for the change to occur? Sounds like a really bad situation for girls to be in.

Or will we hit that coach-led ceiling, get bored with the same skills over and over again done to the Nth degree of perfection, lose fans of the sport and THEN they will finally care about the entertainment factor?

I'm really confused as to what your outlook is, LOL!

 

[Deleted member D3987]

we do put our own limits in place for what the kids do. it really is self evident from an experienced coach's point of view. the most beneficial change they could change is the ends of the balance beam. it would decrease beam dismount injuries tenfold.

next would be an airmat on the panels of floor with the foam and carpet (or carpet bonded foam) on top.

and from there, i would say a vault runway and table up on a scaffold of some type where a, maybe 24 inch resi could be placed for landings with a CLM on top. this would also reuslt in a decrease in injury tenfold.

and i'm not just thinking of the Elite level, but ALL levels of kids competing in gymnastics. when a change is made for apparatus, the change is for the whole world. and not all of the world has the funds to change equipment. you can't believe the "noise" that was heard when we went to the tables. they were 3 grand at that time and now they are approaching 5 grand. you are talking about millions of dollars for the entire world to change their apparatus. it's daunting, really. and FIG has the final say. USAG follows FIG although the JO program can adjust the equipment up and down unlike the Elite level.

USAG does an excellent job of 'policing' the "reckless coach" factor by way of restrictions of skills at certain levels and then our compulsory program. we will always have reckless coaches. we did in the 60's.

as far as entertaining, i think gymnastics has never been more exciting than it is today.

 

[txgymfan]

Great Post Dunno! I love the gymnastics of today but I do have a soft spot for Zamo, Retton ( I know lots don't like her, I do), Omeliancheck ( horrible spelling but I LOVED her floor) and more recently Johnson and Memmel. Sorry for the OT Bog.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

and i still have a crush on Cathy Rigby & Joan Moore...

 

[CoachGoofy]

and maybe you don't remember this? i did a lot of crazy stuff in my youth. maybe Bog can find the whole post i put up from the 60's and 70's when we screwed around at beaches on 3 coasts. i only have it now on CD. but here is another that an old comrade of mine put up. i'm in there. i was 16 during/at this time. Insane Gymnastics Trampoline Rings Pool - YouTube

Not fair. I'd have killed myself trying to twist as loose as someayall.

...assuming my mom didn't kill me first for trying. Very VERY cool. I coach a boy, very talented, who would have been right out there with you if he had the opportunity.

*is moderately jealous of the opportunity & the big skills*

 

[bogwoppit]

Dunno is just lucky he can walk, and that I don't ban him for his crazy assed adventures. Seriously cool though. Will try to dig up that thread.

 

[bogwoppit]

Ack, can't find it. Too bad that was a fun thread. Those old school skills are wicked. Maybe Dunno can recreate a few videos for us??

 

[bogwoppit]

This thread has some interesting gym history stuff in in. Dunno's gym history that is. You have to read through a few pages, but then the story starts to flow. Page 3 is where the fun begins. Link Removed

 

[iwannacoach]

and i still have a crush on Cathy Rigby & Joan Moore...

Please don't say you saw her first (Cathy Rigby).............

Were you one of those wild and crazy guys doing 3/2 twisting double lays at the 1979 Sanda Monica Gymfest. I loved watching the guy's getting, what, like 15 feet of air, really. They were up there so long I had time to look down the beach for my team kids and not miss the landing.

 

[M&G'sMom]

This thread has some interesting gym history stuff in in. Dunno's gym history that is. You have to read through a few pages, but then the story starts to flow. Page 3 is where the fun begins. Link Removed

I'm still reading that thread, but wanted to thank you for digging this out! It's fascinating! Thanks to Dunno for writing it up!

 

[Deleted member D3987]

yes sir. i was there in 1979. muscle beach too.

 

[iwannacoach]

I hate when I double post.

 

[iwannacoach]

Well dunno, I guess that proves that you really are every where. I mean it. I'm starting to duck every time I open a door because I think you're gonna pop out from the other side. Top it off for me, and say you competed pbars at the beach meet, because if you did....... well I guess you could say it was the only time I ever judged you unfairly. No, more likely I gave you a few extra tenths, and Frank Endo took them right back. Man, that dude knew how to scowl, or so it seemed.

Hey, nice sand landings you guys were doing off the swingrings. And somebody posted about the swimming pool looking a bit shallow......... !!!

 

[M&G'sMom]

Okay, I've read the other thread, and now I have different questions:

Why do you think the Yurchenko was admitted as a "safe enough" move when they had to change the vault table to achieve the safety of it? Meaning, do you think the influx of Eastern Bloc coaches who lacked the university training in things like safety and sports ethics or whatnot was responsible for this move being competed by girls before the vault change? If not, what was responsible for it being admitted with equipment changes instead of just banned? If so (the Eastern coaches were responsible), do you see big changes to equipment and whatnot ever being made again unless we get into another bad situation of a huge coach shortage that pushes skills beyond the safety limit on the current equipment?

At this point, I realize there's no way to predict for sure where the sport will go, but I'm fascinated by the theoretical discussion of it, and everyone's differing opinions and the history lessons. Good stuff.