WAG Federal Child Pornography Charges Filed Against Dr. Nassar

[Iwannabemargo]

we also have strict chaperoning guidelines,

no alone time with coaches, or a related pair of coaches, open door policies, strict "friending" guidelines between coaches and athletes - this is in all sport, school, associations ( like scouts etc) . We have had some bad historical abuse and these safeguards were introduced after two school girls were killed by the school caretaker and his girlfriend, these safeguards seem to be helping ( although I doubt we will ever be able to eradicate the problem completely)

interesting. they do this same procedure in your country also.
and btw, your country has sent us a couple of these blokes also. one killed himself and the other has been put out to coaching pastures.

Well I have certainly NEVER heard of it !

Also, we haven't "sent" them to you, I suspect that these checks have made it harder for them to find their victims and like all predators, they have moved on to easier pickings !

 

[Deleted member D3987]

No details are released to the organisation requesting a check. The person (ie applicant) is sent a certificate showing they have passed the check and they show this to the employer. If they don't pass the check, they are sent a letter telling them they have failed the check, and details of where to dispute that finding, if they feel its unfair.

People are on the "banned " list if they have certain criminal convictions, or if employers have had to terminate them for inappropriate conduct. This could be sexual, physical (ie rough handling) mental abuse etc. A person can appeal the findings but they need to prove the allegations are wrong.

Employers are duty bound to report inappropriate conduct to the DBS authority and they then build a case over time. 1 minor incident wont get you a ban, but a history would, as would any conviction or serious incident.

well...we have the same thing. can't go in to details...kids read here. that's just how a couple of coaches have been banned. preponderance and a continuing pattern of behavior. it has already been alluded to in the series of articles...but of course they don't explain.

this is a societal problem no matter where you live. just look at other statistics on rape, sexual assault, incest, etc; did i read somewhere one every 98 seconds?

finally, our industry is being accused of withholding, cover up, conspiracy, ignoring warnings, etc; and even at the highest level of our organization. well then, i'm telling you that it is all NOT true. these things have happened by gov't officials (hey, how about the British TV guy) in churches, schools, and homes.

perspective please...

 

[Deleted member D3987]

we also have strict chaperoning guidelines,

no alone time with coaches, or a related pair of coaches, open door policies, strict "friending" guidelines between coaches and athletes - this is in all sport, school, associations ( like scouts etc) . We have had some bad historical abuse and these safeguards were introduced after two school girls were killed by the school caretaker and his girlfriend, these safeguards seem to be helping ( although I doubt we will ever be able to eradicate the problem completely)



Well I have certainly NEVER heard of it !

Also, we haven't "sent" them to you, I suspect that these checks have made it harder for them to find their victims and like all predators, they have moved on to easier pickings !

well guess what? we had never heard of it either!

and you know what i meant...
edited: both those guys came here with clear credentials.

and we have the same safeguards and protocols also.

 

[bogwoppit]

btw, your country has sent us a couple of these blokes also. one killed himself and the other has been put out to coaching pastures.

It is possible they went to the US to coach because they knew the checks were not as stringent and they could work with children there. In the UK they probably had no way to work with kids.

 

[suebee]

No details are released to the organisation requesting a check. The person (ie applicant) is sent a certificate showing they have passed the check and they show this to the employer. If they don't pass the check, they are sent a letter telling them they have failed the check, and details of where to dispute that finding, if they feel its unfair.

People are on the "banned " list if they have certain criminal convictions, or if employers have had to terminate them for inappropriate conduct. This could be sexual, physical (ie rough handling) mental abuse etc. A person can appeal the findings but they need to prove the allegations are wrong.

Employers are duty bound to report inappropriate conduct to the DBS authority and they then build a case over time. 1 minor incident wont get you a ban, but a history would, as would any conviction or serious incident.

So I'm very curious. Would the coach that was terminated from Buckeye in the letter that was linked to above have passed a DBS check? Buckeye terminated him, but the official reason for termination was taking pictures of gymnasts after the gym made a policy that this was not allowed. There were some things that people found suspicious (giving gifts, taking pictures ), but as the letter pointed out, no recipients of the gifts or the subjects of the pictures or their parents complained - it was the parents of children who did not receive gifts or get pictures who complained! It seems like from the letter posted, there was no evidence of clear wrong-doing or inappropriate conduct.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

It is possible they went to the US to coach because they knew the checks were not as stringent and they could work with children there. In the UK they probably had no way to work with kids.

both those guys came here with clear credentials. but i'm really bringing this up because of all the free/open borders we now all enjoy. a coach can go anywhere in the world to coach...and they do. think about that for a moment.

 

[munchkin3]

they do. they stay at hotels off the ranch property. just as some coaches do. it's a national team training center. you think the 1 parent should stay in the cabins with their child? it's like sardines already.

yes.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

So I'm very curious. Would the coach that was terminated from Buckeye in the letter that was linked to above have passed a DBS check? Buckeye terminated him, but the official reason for termination was taking pictures of gymnasts after the gym made a policy that this was not allowed. There were some things that people found suspicious (giving gifts, taking pictures ), but as the letter pointed out, no recipients of the gifts or the subjects of the pictures or their parents complained - it was the parents of children who did not receive gifts or get pictures who complained! It seems like from the letter posted, there was no evidence of clear wrong-doing or inappropriate conduct.

this is what i was referring too earlier. at that time there was no Federal Law on photos, images, etc; now we do. but some of us, like the owner of Buckeye, were ahead of the curve.

and boy, did i get a ton of crap from parents, before the law, when i wouldn't allow them to take pics or video in my gym because they had no way of doing it where other kids wouldn't be in the screen. and we're supposed to be coaching...not checking equipment. understand?

and now we have sexting and all that other deviant stuff. and what about sporting events? meets? these deviants are everywhere. you stop one and two more pop up somewhere else. they're taking photos and videos. how do you know who is who? how do you screen who comes to a gymnastics meet. the logistics of doing something like that gives me a colossal migraine.

and i would think everyone is not naive. the biggest sporting venue in the world. the Olympic Games. photos and pics are taken. and then they show up somewhere else photo shopped. you hope and pray as an athlete and parent...

 

[Iwannabemargo]

So I'm very curious. Would the coach that was terminated from Buckeye in the letter that was linked to above have passed a DBS check? Buckeye terminated him, but the official reason for termination was taking pictures of gymnasts after the gym made a policy that this was not allowed. There were some things that people found suspicious (giving gifts, taking pictures ), but as the letter pointed out, no recipients of the gifts or the subjects of the pictures or their parents complained - it was the parents of children who did not receive gifts or get pictures who complained! It seems like from the letter posted, there was no evidence of clear wrong-doing or inappropriate conduct.

So, he would have had that noted on his file,

but, correct me if I'm wrong GB coaches, that behaviour would possibly contravene BG safeguarding policies and he would be unable to coach in British Gymnastics. However, if the HC had valid suspicions of other, more inappropriate behaviour, they would have to report that to the governing body (BG in our case) who would hold that on file and pass it on to the DBS.

 

[Iwannabemargo]

Obviously to be banned, inappropriate behaviours have to have taken place, however the additional safeguarding policies are designed to try and weed out the undesirables before that behaviour manifests and children/vulnerable adults are hurt.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

So I'm very curious. Would the coach that was terminated from Buckeye in the letter that was linked to above have passed a DBS check? Buckeye terminated him, but the official reason for termination was taking pictures of gymnasts after the gym made a policy that this was not allowed. There were some things that people found suspicious (giving gifts, taking pictures ), but as the letter pointed out, no recipients of the gifts or the subjects of the pictures or their parents complained - it was the parents of children who did not receive gifts or get pictures who complained! It seems like from the letter posted, there was no evidence of clear wrong-doing or inappropriate conduct.

hypothetical: what if the coach was charged and arrested years ago of 'you know what'...like over 30 years ago. but at the time the criminal laws and statutes were different than they are today. and these laws have always varied from state to state anyway.

so the coach pleads to a lesser charge of "battery". battery at that time was a misdemeanor. he waits a year and then pays his attorney to have his record "expunged". he's now no longer in/a/any system.

in this 'hypothetical' he does 'you know what' again. who's at fault?

 

[Deleted member D3987]

hypothetical: someone gets busted. he does prison time. gets out. gets remarried. legally changes his last name. so much time has passed he goes to work somewhere at either a 'member club' or even a non member club. he does 'you know what again'. who's at fault?

 

[Jenny]

You can't have your record expunged here. Stays for good. As do accusations

 

[munchkin3]

The reality is that these scumbags have, and always will find a way to be around children. period.

 

[Iwannabemargo]

okay,

in the examples above, here your record is never "expunged". Convictions can be "spent", ie you did your time in prison, but it always stays on your record and DBS has access to that.

We don't have the misdomeanor/felony thing here either, a crime is a crime

Also if you change your name you have to do it legally and your old name follows you officially, so DBS will know.

 

[Iwannabemargo]

The reality is that these scumbags have, and always will find a way to be around children. period.

true - the idea is to make is as hard as possible for the vulnerable to get hurt

 

[Deleted member D3987]

um...hypothetical: someone gets busted for 'you know what'. he does prison time. wife takes over the business. he gets back with her when he gets out. HEY! but some rules changed!

this guy can't go on the floor of a NGB's sanctioned event. no background check in place yet. but he's a convicted felon. but HEY!!! he wants to work!!!!
so he sues the NGB to get his credentials back. poor bastard...the NGB prevailed.

cost the NGB a ton of money to defend their right to keep a POS off a competition floor and away from the kids. but the guy is still coaching...hypothetically, of course.

who's fault? and was our 'system' flawed that he was allowed to file suit (civil rights and employment law) to get his credentials back? hypothetically speaking, of course.

so now what say you all? who's fault??

 

[munchkin3]

margo- but they will just get better......

 

[Jenny]

hypothetical: someone gets busted. he does prison time. gets out. gets remarried. legally changes his last name. so much time has passed he goes to work somewhere at either a 'member club' or even a non member club. he does 'you know what again'. who's at fault?

I think his record stays with him here through the name change........ DBS checks include name changes, place of birth etc. You have to give passport numbers and bank account details etc etc to get it. Just looking at mine it says DBS check includes details of convictions, cautions, reprimands, Warnings from Police. It also includes any other relevant info at the discretion of the Police with due regard to the position sought. So that allows them to include accusations if they feel / see a pattern even if not charged.

You can dispute the contents if you don't like them.

No system is foolproof. I like that we are trying very hard because there have been some very bad incidences here. It doesn't matter where you are coaching/ volunteering / working. Member / non member. Anyone regularly with children must have one. It is not a gymnastics thing it is a government thing.

 

[Deleted member D3987]

okay,

in the examples above, here your record is never "expunged". Convictions can be "spent", ie you did your time in prison, but it always stays on your record and DBS has access to that.

We don't have the misdomeanor/felony thing here either, a crime is a crime

Also if you change your name you have to do it legally and your old name follows you officially, so DBS will know.

right. understood. so you see, England is one country no states. USA is one country (hard to believe sometimes) and 50 states. each state has different laws and statutes that deal with the same issues. this is why the lawyer has to be granted license in the BAR varying state to state. some states accept a license from another state with a simple signature and some background. others not.