WAG L4 mobility score

[John]

Here in Australia up until 2 years ago kids had their own optional routines in the compulsory levels. They were still compulsory levels as the kids had to put in the same skills but their each had their own music and routines.

For example the level 4 floor routine had to have
Round off
Cartwheel cartwheel
Back extension roll to front support
A leap series with 2 split leaps
A jump full turn
A full turn on 1 foot

But any music, any order of skills, any dance etc.

Most gyms had individual routines for each gymnast, but some just made up one routine for everyone in the same level.

Exactly what I was trying to say. A coach could then develop three or four routines that fit the tumbling styles that coach identifies as important.

I find it peculiar that some tout gymnastics is each child's individual journey then take a breath and say compulsories is great. I believe compulsory is defined: required by law or a rule; obligatory. That is not the definition of individual

I can equate that to other sports, let us say baseball. We only teach kids to play infield cause no kids want to play outfield and as coaches and parents, we think we can pigeonhole every kid into a shortstop. Is that a good plan to develop the sport of baseball?

 

[raenndrops]

Exactly what I was trying to say. A coach could then develop three or four routines that fit the tumbling styles that coach identifies as important.

I find it peculiar that some tout gymnastics is each child's individual journey then take a breath and say compulsories is great. I believe compulsory is defined: required by law or a rule; obligatory. That is not the definition of individual

I can equate that to other sports, let us say baseball. We only teach kids to play infield cause no kids want to play outfield and as coaches and parents, we think we can pigeonhole every kid into a shortstop. Is that a good plan to develop the sport of baseball?

Using your baseball analogy... in T-Ball, they have every kid play every position so they can learn how to do every position. THEN, as they move to higher levels, they begin to individualize (T-Ball would be roughly equivalent to compulsories and higher levels would be like Optionals).
I believe that coaches should treat gymnasts as individuals BUT compulsories have all gymnasts learning the same skills, which is important in the progression from beginning gymnast to higher level gymnast.
In school, all kids learn the same things in elementary school. Starting in middle school, they can pick and choose a few classes and in high school they pick and choose more (still some specific requirements but others they can choose from various options) and in college, they can take pretty much anything (they choose a major and take the classes they want that will fulfill the major requirements).
Elementary = Compulsories (and Xcel in some gyms)
Middle School = Xcel (in other gyms) and Level 6
High School = Level 7 and Xcel (in still other gyms)
College = L8+

 

[John]

Using your baseball analogy... in T-Ball, they have every kid play every position so they can learn how to do every position. THEN, as they move to higher levels, they begin to individualize (T-Ball would be roughly equivalent to compulsories and higher levels would be like Optionals).
I believe that coaches should treat gymnasts as individuals BUT compulsories have all gymnasts learning the same skills, which is important in the progression from beginning gymnast to higher level gymnast.
In school, all kids learn the same things in elementary school. Starting in middle school, they can pick and choose a few classes and in high school they pick and choose more (still some specific requirements but others they can choose from various options) and in college, they can take pretty much anything (they choose a major and take the classes they want that will fulfill the major requirements).
Elementary = Compulsories (and Xcel in some gyms)
Middle School = Xcel (in other gyms) and Level 6
High School = Level 7 and Xcel (in still other gyms)
College = L8+

Agree on school and the problem is my 11 year old has already begun to dislike school.

 

[LindyHopper]

Agree on school and the problem is my 11 year old has already begun to dislike school.

Out of curiosity, is she in middle school yet?

My 11 year old doesn't dislike school, but if she had a choice, she probably wouldn't go. It's not so much school she dislikes as the obligations involved. She does like the minor freedoms afforded by middle school.

 

[LindyHopper]

Out of curiosity, is she in middle school yet?

My 11 year old doesn't dislike school, but if she had a choice, she probably wouldn't go. It's not so much school she dislikes as the obligations involved. She does like the minor freedoms afforded by middle school.

Nevermind... didn't mean to derail the topic at hand. Alas, too late to delete.

 

[John]

No she is in 5th and in her school District that is the last grade of elementary. I would love to hear more. I hate the thought she does not like school at 11. Makes me sad.

Personally I think this dislike of school comes from boredom or blocks in school. I believe my fight on level 4 score is to keep kids in gymnastics is the very same feelings my girl is having in school.

I'd live to find some solutions.

 

[Natasha]

No she is in 5th and in her school District that is the last grade of elementary. I would love to hear more. I hate the thought she does not like school at 11. Makes me sad.

Personally I think this dislike of school comes from boredom or blocks in school. I believe my fight on level 4 score is to keep kids in gymnastics is the very same feelings my girl is having in school.

I'd live to find some solutions.

Does your area have Xcel? Because Xcel is USAG's solution to offering an alternative to help keep girls in the sport as is the invention of Level 6.

 

[mom2newgymnast]

I find it peculiar that some tout gymnastics is each child's individual journey then take a breath and say compulsories is great. I believe compulsory is defined: required by law or a rule; obligatory. That is not the definition of individual
....
No she is in 5th and in her school District that is the last grade of elementary. I would love to hear more. I hate the thought she does not like school at 11. Makes me sad.

Personally I think this dislike of school comes from boredom or blocks in school. I believe my fight on level 4 score is to keep kids in gymnastics is the very same feelings my girl is having in school.

I'd live to find some solutions.

I'm kind of confused as to why you are so anti compulsories. Especially since your daughter never even competed in them. I understand that scores vary per region and, from what I am reading, possibly 34 is too high in some regions. But where I live, a gymnast that doesn't earn a 34 during the season really most likely isn't ready to move on to the next level. My daughter just finished competing level 5 and she started at level 2, so she spent 4 years competing in compulsories. I just don't see the big deal, it's just how things are done. She learned a lot of foundational skills with great form and she is more than ready to move on to optionals. Is she excited to have her own routine finally? Yes, of course! But she never complained about being bored or questioned the process of getting to where she is. Do I think she could have scored out of a level along the way and done fine? Most likely yes. But I don't see the hurry and I am actually glad of her pace and of her solid mastery of the skills that she has. I guess I just don't understand what the problem with spending time in compulsories is in your opinion? Why the hurry to get to higher levels before mastering the lower levels? To me it doesn't make sense to rush through just to struggle later. I'd rather she learn to do things great in the beginning.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I find it peculiar that some tout gymnastics is each child's individual journey then take a breath and say compulsories is great. I believe compulsory is defined: required by law or a rule; obligatory. That is not the definition of individual

I can equate that to other sports, let us say baseball. We only teach kids to play infield cause no kids want to play outfield and as coaches and parents, we think we can pigeonhole every kid into a shortstop. Is that a good plan to develop the sport of baseball?

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I find it peculiar that some tout gymnastics is each child's individual journey then take a breath and say compulsories is great. I believe compulsory is defined: required by law or a rule; obligatory. That is not the definition of individual

I can equate that to other sports, let us say baseball. We only teach kids to play infield cause no kids want to play outfield and as coaches and parents, we think we can pigeonhole every kid into a shortstop. Is that a good plan to develop the sport of baseball?

Let’s try this again, I don’t know where my response went to.

No one said on this thread or perhaps even this site ever said compulsories are great. They are exactly their definition, obligatory.

Regarding it being individual. You are trying to be far to literal. It is individual as to how their path goes, how long at levels, how quick they get or lose things. How far they go.

Compulsory levels are building blocks of skills. The levels and components build on the previous.it makes for stronger gymnasts. In fact that is why many gyms have kids repeat. I have found this to be true with my one child, I find that going through the levels until competent has made her a stronger gymnast.

And your baseball comparison doesn’t fly either. It’s apples and oranges.

Baseball is a team sport. Gymnastics is an individual sport that can have a team component.

You can compete at a meet with just one gymnast from a gym it happens quite often. You can not have a regulation baseball game without 9 people.

And to your playing individual positions, most gymmies don’t get to specialize until they have learned the basics of all positions. Those positions being called vault, bars, beam and floor. Much like early baseball players.

Really opinions everyone has one. Personally I like them having a period of time where they are measured against the same standard/routine. That there routines that are exactly the same that they are all doing. I would like to see a compulsory type component all the way up to the max level for a team competition. But then USAG doesn’t care what I think.

 

[John]

Exactly my daughter in my opinion is better off not having to had to do years of compulsory gymnastics. Will she suffer because of it? Time will tell. Obligatory is fine for some I prefer to have my daughter lead instead of follow.

 

[Flyaway]

Exactly my daughter in my opinion is better off not having to had to do years of compulsory gymnastics. Will she suffer because of it? Time will tell. Obligatory is fine for some I prefer to have my daughter lead instead of follow.

I'm trying to not be annoyed by this comment or take it personally. But as a parent of a child who is doing her time in compulsories and working her butt off, just know that it comes off a little arrogant.

 

[John]

Not meant arrogantly, apologies. My DD did years of cartwheel tuck jump gymnastics. Hardest pass one year was cartwheel backwalkover or maybe Valdez backwalkover.

But her routines were always her own.

I am beating a dead horse I bow out of this thread.

OP I hope your daughter gets her score out and moves one. Tell her to have fun and BE GREAT.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I'm trying to not be annoyed by this comment or take it personally. But as a parent of a child who is doing her time in compulsories and working her butt off, just know that it comes off a little arrogant.

Yep. My poor girl is a compulsory kid.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

Exactly my daughter in my opinion is better off not having to had to do years of compulsory gymnastics. Will she suffer because of it? Time will tell. Obligatory is fine for some I prefer to have my daughter lead instead of follow.

It’s funny our gym until the kids get to optionals did both IGC and USAG JO. Yes the girls did both both USAG JO and USAIGC.

Since my girl was L2. She has had a fall JO season and a spring IGC season, with her own music and routines.

Why? Because our coaches believe a few things

First gymnastics is gymnastics. A BHS, BWO, LO, whatever should be performed well no matter what organization you compete it in

Next the feel the JO compulsory program best prepares the gymmies In the basic/core skills to perform those skills well and with good form. They also happen to be good coaches.

But they also felt having the IGC experience helps them develope a sense of their own style and gives the fun of picking their own music and routines.

And if it came down to only doing only one they pick USAG JO. They believe it makes stronger gymnasts.

As a parent who has actually had a child do and.have seen all three main programs in action and meets (USAG JO, Xcel and USAIGC) I agree.

 

[John]

I thought about the last few comments here. I feel sorry for all of the commentors. Instead of holding a conversation, telling me where I have gone wrong you make childish comments. I guess this is how bullying is taught at home.

If you are happy with the path your daughters have taken then why the resentment and anger.

I made a comment about the path my daughter has been on and if you are confident in your decisions then be happy, or feel sorry for my daughter for having a neglectful father.

I was not happy with the direction my daughters path had taken, I made a change. I moved her to JO I do not regret letting her learn some big skills before Fear sets in. She is improving and time will tell if she reaches her goals.

 

[Deleted member 18037]

I thought about the last few comments here. I feel sorry for all of the commentors. Instead of holding a conversation, telling me where I have gone wrong you make childish comments.

Haven’t heard any childish comments. No responses to points made either.

But you are correct time will tell.

 

[raenndrops]

I thought about the last few comments here. I feel sorry for all of the commentors. Instead of holding a conversation, telling me where I have gone wrong you make childish comments. I guess this is how bullying is taught at home.

If you are happy with the path your daughters have taken then why the resentment and anger.

I made a comment about the path my daughter has been on and if you are confident in your decisions then be happy, or feel sorry for my daughter for having a neglectful father.

I was not happy with the direction my daughters path had taken, I made a change. I moved her to JO I do not regret letting her learn some big skills before Fear sets in. She is improving and time will tell if she reaches her goals.

I didn't see any childish comments or bullying.
Actually, nobody even said you were wrong... just that your one comment sounded arrogant and your baseball comparison didn't work for reasons they explained.

Everyone's path through gymnastics is different.
My OG competed 2 years of Old L4. 1 year of Old L5. 1 year of Old L6. Took 3.5 or so months off. Competed 1.5 seasons of Xcel Gold. Took 2 years off. Competed 1 year of L6. Is taking at least most, if not all of this year off, but hoping to get back into the gym to compete L7 next season and probably the year after that (but maybe L8 if she gets the skills).

My YG competed 2 years of Old L4 and a year of L3 (her choice because of the "grapevine" on beam in L4) which was a good choice for her because she didn't get her kip or beam cartwheel that summer. Then she competed a year of Xcel Gold. Then she took a year off. Then she competed another year of Xcel Gold. This year, she is competing Xcel Platinum. She will repeat Platinum next year. After that, she may or may not compete L6 (petition in as a freshman at the earliest).

I see the importance of compulsories, but I also see the importance of making your gymnastics your own. I like the way @Deleted member 18037 's gym does the separate seasons so the girls can do both compulsory and optional routines the same year. There is a gym near me that does the same thing and it works well for them.

 

[3rd_time_around]

Exactly my daughter in my opinion is better off not having to had to do years of compulsory gymnastics. Will she suffer because of it? Time will tell. Obligatory is fine for some I prefer to have my daughter lead instead of follow."


"I'm trying to not be annoyed by this comment or take it personally. But as a parent of a child who is doing her time in compulsories and working her butt off, just know that it comes off a little arrogant."
Feeling the same way. Even the comment that you feel sorry for the rest of us. We were having a conversation. The way you said this does come off arrogant or condescending. Our girls aren't "following" just because they started in compulsories, which is the way it is set up to be; neither is your girl a "leader" for scoring out of compulsories.

 

[LindyHopper]

@John

Throughout this thread, I have viewed your opinions as being those of someone who has tried to make the best decisions for your daughter that you could, and that you are confident in those decisions.

When we form opinions, we do so based on our personal world view, which is based on our own personal experiences. In other words, we go with what we know.

I've interpreted your POV to be that you have been very happy with the path your daughter has taken. It has worked for both her and your family. Because of that, it could be challenging for you to see why anyone would want to do it any other way.

Your daughter came from a different program, a different structure where she built her foundation of strong basic skills. She has obviously been well prepared, to a point where her first experiences with USAG are scoring out of 4 & 5, and omitting 6 without a worry. Yay! That is why mobility scores exist. So that gymnasts can prove that they no longer need to compete a level, because they are proficient.

But we keep harping on the word "individual". Your daughter may have HATED JO compulsory levels become bored and struggled, and she may have thrived--we will never know. Just as some very successful gymnasts who worked their way through compulsory gymnastics may have thrived on or struggled on the path your daughter has taken.

None of us really LIKE compulsory gymnastics (which is probably why all of the compulsory stuff has been removed from gymnastics and figure skating on the world stage over the past 30 or so years--BORING!) but many of us see value in them.

Honestly, (and I could be wrong here) I think your aversion to compulsory gymnastics is that your daughter has been successful without them, and they're boring.

I don't think you're putting down anyone who does compulsory gymnastics (or their parents), or that you think your daughter is superior. I just think you're expressing your personal opinion that you are pleased with the path your daughter has taken, and that you're glad that you (and she) didn't have to spend any time doing something you may see as boring and/or limiting.